Talk:Bobby Beausoleil

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subject's history. Believing that neutrality is paramount in an article reporting on a living person, this editor will vigorously resist attempts to introduce such bias that defaces this biographical article. Any responsible person who invests any time at all in researching the subject, Bobby Beausoleil, will find more than ample reliable information to support including, in addition to the criminal history, his decades of noteworthy professional achievements within the summary contained in the article. WP:BOLP says "Criticism and praise should be included if they can be sourced to reliable secondary sources, so long as the material is presented responsibly, conservatively, and in a disinterested tone...Bewared of claims that rely on guilt by association, and biased, malicious or overly promotional content. The idea expressed in meta:Eventualism-that every Knowledge articles is a work in progress, and that it is therefore okay for an article to be temporarily unbalanced because it will eventually be brought into shape-does not apply to biographies. Given their potential impact on biography subjects' lives, biographies must be fair to their subjects at all times."

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mere footnote in his article, but unfortunately it happened close enough to, and is tied to murders that occurred in Beverly Hills, California. I imagine he never dreamed at the time how much press coverage this would get, including multiple movies and documentaries, but unfortunately it did. The name Manson was legendary growing up, on the same level as the devil (how's that for an album title?). When you needed a go-to evil person (ie: "don't go out there at night or some Charles Manson will get you"), Manson was the number one choice. You can blame Hollywood, but I'm sorry to say that due to the high-profile nature of this particular case, it is never going away. What we are bound to do by our policy is to document the things that make a person notable (the reason they have an article) in proportion to the significance of that information to their notability. It's not about who they are, were, or will become, but what they are known most for. The good news is that Mr. Beausoleil has the ultimate power to affect this himself, in the real world, by continuing to make a name for himself in the music industry.

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documentary film that I have not seen. I don't think we should assume that the content of that film is correct – especially if much of it came from Beausoleil and Manson. I corrected some aspects of that edit already, for reasons stated in edit summaries. That edit also added several references to the website cielodrive.com. It does not seem clear that the website cielodrive.com is a reliable source (although I have some respect for it). That edit may also have some other problems. I am very tempted to just revert that whole edit, because it has multiple problems and I think it is the responsibility of the person wanting to make changes to do so in a less wholesale fashion and justify what they are doing. The rest of us should not be required to clean up a mess made by someone else. —

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the creative arts both prior to and during incarceration are included. While I understand that some may have animus towards anyone who has been associated with Charles Manson, this cannot be the guiding principle in accurate and complete reporting. No person is entirely defined by the worst thing that they have done. His occupation for the last 50 years is not best described as prisoner. Beausoleil created during his incarceration, Lucifer Rising, which he is most known for and has gone on to release 9 albums, 4 compilations, and 5 singles. He has been creating art since the 80s with a gallery show in 2005 in California (at Clair Obscura) which is referenced on his page and one in 2015 at the Contemporary Art Tasmania in Australia

2626:. One is that it replaces the story of Hinman's murder with the "Straight Satan" story, as if that version of the events is unquestioned fact. In reality, my understanding that this is a story that was told only many years after the murder and comes primarily from Beausoleil himself. As far as I know, there was no mention of "Straight Satans" or the purported drug deal in the trial or in other contemporaneous reports – what was said at the time was about a rumor of Hinman inheriting money. The rumor of inheritance has been completely removed from the article by Griffdawg567. Rather than just give one description of the events and assume that is true, I prefer to describe 2097:

is just a summary of the rest of the article, so anything there should already be sourced somewhere below. The prominence and weight given in the lede should reflect the prominence and weight given in the body. I find edit warring to be distasteful and beneath me, and strongly recommend Mnpie to cease and desist, and work this stuff out on the talk page until a consensus is reached. If they continue to revert without discussion, then report it as a slow edit-war on ANI or a similar noticeboard.

464: 443: 660: 639: 474: 385: 1038: 299: 264: 233: 2171:, to name a few. There seems to be some fundamental misunderstandings of NPOV, UNDUE, RS, V, NOR, MOS, BLP, etc... People often focus too much on one little portion of a policy or another, but they all work together and augment each other, depend on each other, and while BLP works in accordance with and is augmented by all of the other policies, it ultimately trumps all other policies. There appears to be sort of a 361: 409: 1887:

editors. The opening paragraph is being reverted as well, duplicating the form used on the wiki page for Bob Dylan: Known by name first, born name in parentheses. That is would be an issue to anyone is just silly, given that the title of the page is Bobby Beausoleil. Anyone can start their own page called Robert Kenneth Beausoleil, and if someone chooses to do so, this editor promises not to interfere.

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information and was given a 4.5-star rating. Portions of that soundtrack have also been used in several other motion pictures by reputable filmmakers, including Gasper Noe and Chris Moukarbel, including a recent documentary about Lady Gaga. In addition to this album, he has created and released 8 others, all currently in world distribution. This in addition to being very productive as a visual artist.

285: 575: 554: 670: 1619:? There is a consensus that it should say that he is "serving a life sentence in the California state prison system for first-degree murder." In that case, he can hardly have an occupation. I propose a more neutral alternative: "Robert Kenneth Beausoleil (born November 6, 1947), is an American citizen serving a life sentence in the California state prison system for first-degree murder." 854:

authority you speak to me like that, but this is the page to discuss the link and it will be discussed here whether you accept it or not. That said I see your point 11 and by extension this boils down to whether COL SCOTT on that page is a recognizable authority or not. I will ask several authorities for their opinion and should they agree, then that is that.

309: 2739:, which i understand to mean that we should put the major reason the subject is notable in it, not a list of secondarily important things. In this case, there is no doubt that Beausoleil is notable almost entirely because of his involvement with Manson and murder; anything he's done since is very definitely secondary. Happy days, ~ 2675:

Beausoleil went with Atkins and Brunner to Hinman's house, where Beausoleil had also briefly been living, demanding that he give them money, but Hinman told them he didn't have any money to give them. Beausoleil called Manson at Spahn Ranch and told him no money was forthcoming, and was instructed by

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Resolving the most egregious BLP vios, mostly this is a content dispute which should be resolved though the usual means, ie: talk page discussions, RFCs, mediation, or even arbitration if that's what it takes. But first all parties need to make a serious attempt to work it out on the talk page rather

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Sigh... Feel free to report me wherever you like. I look forward to seeing the response. You are acting in direct and blatant contravention of Knowledge guidelines, too numerous to list. All I will do for the moment is to correct the most obvious errors in your formatting and then - if there is no

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Your assertion that Beausoleil is not qualified to having a professional history as a musician and artist is patently absurd. This assertion is obviously rooted in willful ignorance. All you have to do is click through the references already on the page to verify Beausoleil’s creative history. More

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It is evident that you have vindictive sentiments towards Beausoleil based on the crime he committed half a century ago. You are entitled to possess these sentiments, as you have good cause, but you are not entitled to use Knowledge to express them. Knowledge is an encyclopedia established for being

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Your attempts to remove these aspects of the history are vandalism. It is clear you are trying to "blackwash" the subject to make it conform to your personal orientation in regards to the subject. Truthful and honest valid reporting trumps that. Further attempts by you or any user will be reported to

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If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on

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Yes, but the surname is what makes it substantially different. If he had just decided to use "Bob Zimmerman", we would just start the article with "Robert Allen Zimmerman (born May 24, 1941) is an American singer-songwriter ..." instead of "Bob Zimmerman (born Robert Allen Zimmerman on May 24, 1941)

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Not surprisingly, I also concur with BarrelProof for the reasons already stated. I reverted Mnpie's latest edit, not so much because I want to be involved in this dispute but because (as the quote on my user page says) animals, including humans, are motivated by wanting something rather than getting

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I fully agree with that and with what Zaereth said in the BLP Noticeboard discussion: "It's ... weird to start off with, 'Subject is a man incarcerated in a prison.' That's not what he is notable for, nor is he notable for being a musician. He's clearly notable as being a convicted murderer, and the

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The paragraph you removed regarding details about the parole hearing was taken directly from the decision portion of the 2019 hearing transcript. This was sourced properly and indexed accordingly. Therefore, you are engaging in vandalism and in violation of the user terms of agreement for Knowledge

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There's balance, and there is WP:UNDUE ... to call this murderer an actor based on bit/brief appearances in what are basically films or shorts documenting the scene - meh. I wouldn't call him an actor. Vanity press issues of one's own unmemorable 'music' didn't make him a professional musician. He's

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We seem to have a content dispute over whether Beausoleil should be identified in the infobox with "occupation = Multimedia artist, musician". As best I can tell, his occupation for the last 50 years is best described as "prisoner", and his primary notability is for being a murderer and associate of

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I will say, for the record, in response to all the appeals to emotion, that I am glad Mr. Beausoleil has reformed and wish him great luck in his career. We're not here to try and punish or smear anyone --that's what BLP is all about. If this crime had happened in Somewhere, Minnesota, it would be a

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While I agree that the previous version was better balanced and more accurate, I have to agree with Mnpie's removal of the official legal documents, which per BLPPRIMARY should not be used as sources under any circumstances. The lede does not even need sources; those should be in the body. The lede

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All edits have been properly sourced and referenced after extensive research, with the intention of creating a complete profile of the subject, not merely focusing on the negative. No attempt is being made to leave any of the bad things out of reporting. Other significant attributes such as work in

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Those comments quoted by Mnpie1789 were from much earlier in the conversation. Mnpie1789, please stop edit warring over the characterization in the opening sentence. It is clear that you are continuing to oppose the consensus over both the characterization of Beausoleil in the opening sentence and

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Again, the name of this page is BOBBY BEAUSOLEIL, the name that he has gone by his entire life since infancy, both personally and professionally. This should not be a matter of debate if you take into consideration that everyone who knows him or is familiar with his history knows him by this name.

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It is well known that Beausoleil began playing music professionally at age 17, years before committing a crime. He was a member of the musician’s union for those years. His soundtrack for the Kenneth Anger film was reviewed by All Music, widely accepted as one foremost reliable sources of music

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It is clear to everyone that you have enmity towards Beausoleil on the basis of him having been an associate of Charles Manson and who committed a brutal murder. That is understandable and you are entitled to feel that way. However, your remarks reflect a blatant prejudice. Responsible editors on

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It is not spam because you merely state so. I see the page histories but I merely see you reverted every time without discussion. I find no discussion anywhere. I therefore will have one here. If the discussion here concludes the link valid, then your reversion will be I am not sure by what

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plausible versions and document the reliable sources where these versions of the facts came from. We should not necessarily believe what Beausoleil (and perhaps Manson) said a decade or more after the murder. There is a lot in that edit by Griffdawg567. Much of it seems to be sourced to a recent

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motivation that borders on the level of fandom (keep in mind "fan" is short for "fanatic", meaning someone who is intrinsically and irrationally biased toward...), with a righteous, no holds barred, "damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead" approach. Definitely suggests someone on a mission. Not to

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Well it's more than that. There's a failure to seek consensus, and quite possibly a misunderstanding of what the term means. Consensus is not a counting of votes but a weighing of arguments, and if a person's argument fails to convince others, consensus is against them. In not all but many cases

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The use of "citizen" seems a bit strange to me (and I see you didn't include it in your own edit). I checked the opening sentences of articles about two other Manson associates (one male and one female) and two other living incarcerated Americans (one male and one female) selected at random from

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The content dispute also involves the lead sentence, regarding whether it should say "... is an American murderer serving a life sentence ..." or "is an American musician and multi-disciplined artist serving a life sentence ..." Clearly, I suggest the former rather than the latter. Beausoleil is

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is not always short for "Robert", just as "Sam" is not always short for "Samantha". Sometimes it's short for "Stephanie" and sometimes for "Samuel", and sometimes for Lucifer's original name "Samael", before getting tossed out of heaven. And sometimes it's just "Sam". We almost always begin an

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There is no dispute that Beasoleil murdered a man, and that it was indeed a savage crime. He himself has admitted this on numerous occasions over a long period of time, but for more people than you would be willing to admit exist, Beausoleil is also a respected musician and artist with a modest

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At the bottom of the article, there is an external link to the "Home page of Bobby and Barbara Beausoleil". What is that? Did he marry in prison??? (if so, the Knowledge entry makes no mention of this). Am I to believe that that is a photo of the Manson Family's Bobby Beausoleil??? What is

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I have reviewed the link. It is to the Official Tate LaBianca Blog. This is a blog that over the last two years has become the primary research site for the TLB case. It has primary research and many articles. There is no question in my mind that it is a valid link and should be reinstated.

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I wonder if it would be OK to include in the opening statement that Bobby is a music artist. He has collaborations with lady Gaga and several music albums that are on apple music, spotify etc. Other convicts also have information about their creative careers, such as Danny Masterson. Thoughts?

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As we have discussed, his notability is nothing to do with his activities as a "musician and multi-disciplined artist". His notability - the only reason he has an article - is because he is a convicted murderer. That is not mentioned in your opening sentence, but needs to be the focus of the

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I don't know that actor is really accurate in terms of the primary, initial description of him - he didn't really act in much - there's not much to the "Acting Career" section. Also, the article states he was a member of The Grass Roots/Love and that's the primiary focus of the "Music Career"

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WP:NPOV "All articles must adhere to NPOV, fairly representing all majority and significant-minority viewpoints published by reliable sources..." This editor invites other Knowledge editors to help in preserving the integrity and neutrality of this article, and to prevent it from becoming an

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Please be advised that there are some Wiki users who wish to use this BLP article as a "murderer profile" page, a strategy that flies in the face of a code Knowledge policy: Balance and Neutral Point of View (NVOP), if that strategy deliberately excludes significant mitigating aspects of the

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I have no problem at all over removing the official legal documents, and indeed thanked Mnpie1789 for those edits. The issue is simply over the right balance in the opening paragraph, and the failure of Mnpie1789 so far to accept a wording that recognises that Beausoleil's notability (per

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By the way, most of the information about Beausoleil’s work in the creative arts was added to the page by other contributors before this editor began contributing to it. Clearly, your opinion does not make a consensus. In any case what is important there is not consensus but accuracy and

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this page are creating a balanced presentation of the information. There has been no attempt to minimize the crime or to whitewash the subject in any way, but only to include other aspects of his life that are in fact valid and of interest, despite your evident prejudice against him.

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The edit-warring over the opening paragraph - seeking to describe him primarily as a musician, rather than as a murderer, contrary to the evident majority view of editors at all discussions so far - is, unfortunately, continuing. The only solution, it seems to me, is to seek to have

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Do not call other user's edits vandalism unless they actually are vandalism. Because I was following policy and reverted the link to the blog appropriately the edits were not vandalism. If it is found that the edits were wrong then one must not immediately call vandalism, remember

2655:, please do come here and discuss your edit; you won't find us unreasonable, but such a vast change to the heart of the article definitely needs discussion. Perhaps we can aim for something along the lines BarrelProof offers, with multiple plausible accounts given. Happy days, 1838:

because that is the title of the article and it is commonplace for "Robert" to be shortened to "Bobby". But that is a minor point. As others have said, there are no reliable sources that describe him primarily as a "musician and multi-disciplined artist" - only his own pages

889:. If your authorities want to come contribute to the discussion on this talk page, they're more than welcome to join in. But you running off to survey self-selected "authorities" doesn't cut it. (PS: Saying "official" in the blog name doesn't make it an authority.) -- 1193:

That is the webpage for Beausoleil and his wife. Yes, he married in prison. It's not on the page because there isn't much out there to source it at this time. And yes, that is a photo of the Manson Family's Bobby Beausoleil. If you look at the old pictures of Bobby

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it, even if it means not necessarily liking what they get. The opposite of motivation happens upon getting the reward. Hopefully, Mnpie will try to work this out collaboratively rather than combatively or dictatively, which never goes over well around here.

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mention their history suggests an SPA, adding to the suspicion that there may be some COI also at play. (Not sure, just thinking out loud.) The behavior to me seems very much disruptive rather than collaborative, but that's a matter for a different board.

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for example. That's how the manual of style says to do it, and this is concurrent with the Chicago Manual of Style and Reuters Manual of Style, to name a few. It's just more formal and professional that way, and an encyclopedia is a very formal work.

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I read the link. No slight intended but based on what it says, are you saying you are stupid not evil? I don't get it. The authorities would be the people with the top websites on the case, Mark Turner at www.charliemanson.com and Bret at

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That's a pretty strong consensus. Again truth and accuracy trumps prejudice. If someone would like to start a new page called Robert Beausoleil, they are free to do so, but efforts will be sustained to preserve the integrity of this page.

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The title and subject of this page is Bobby Beausoleil therefore given name is noted secondarily (see Bob Dylan's wiki page). Also, I changed American murderer to American man due to BarrelProof and Ghmyrtle comments below from February.

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The difference is that Bob Dylan officially changed his name in 1962. That is far different than having your name shortened into a nickname, unless he officially changed it to "Bobby". Why is this so important to you anyhow? Look at

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Okay, now that that part is settled: Merely having a link to a blog on a website does not indicate that the website is a recognized authority. The website was also determined by several administrators and users to be inappropriate.

2041:. Do not re-add court documents or other records. (The information attached to them also needs removal, but then again , this entire article needs to be gutted and started over from scratch to bring it into Knowledge standards.) 2599: 2375: 153: 2344: 1127:

section. However, the founder of the group says he wasn't a member - he came around sometimes and hung out played rythym guitar, but was not a member. However, he has focused on music in his life in prison.

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Myself, i don't think it's necessary to change the opening paragraph of the lead; there is information about Beausoleil's music (and other activities) in the second paragraph, which should be sufficient.

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there is no point in arguing with or trying to convince the other person; you should be trying to convince everyone else. And there are a huge number of logical fallacies in Mnpie's arguments, in icluding

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A further comment on the "Robert" versus "Bobby" issue: There is no ill will associated with calling him "Robert" rather than "Bobby" in the opening sentence. This is the common practice on Knowledge, per

1972:. All of those articles start with the formal name and make no mention of the common nickname that is the title of the article, because the relationship to the nickname is considered obvious. Regarding 1865:

That must be one VERY small circle who considers him a "multi-media artist." Besides Beausoleil himself, and a few Manson hanger-on's, who exactly would that be for considering this for WIKI inclusion??

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Comment moved here from previous location, where it was buried in an old/finished discussion; i'm neither endorsing nor criticising the suggestion, simply making it a bit more visible. Happy days, ~

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he first sentence should introduce the topic, and tell the nonspecialist reader what or who the subject is...o not overload the first sentence by describing everything notable about the subject

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article should begin with just that. Everything else about his notability is without a doubt a far second to this, and the balance of the article should reflect that." … "Even in sources like

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a source for reliable, accurate, and comprehensive information. It is not a form for trolling, “blackwashing”, or a blog where expressing a narrow or biased point of view maybe acceptable.

621: 586:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Crime and Criminal Biography articles on Knowledge. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join 1508: 1400: 1272: 1084:

is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Knowledge policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

2265:(secondary and tertiary) reliable, non-fringe sources. The article should start with a plain statement of his primary source of notability, which does not involve music and artistry. — 2775: 375: 2338: 2785: 1526: 1522: 1418: 1414: 1290: 1286: 756:

Should it be included? An edit summary suggests that this issue was discussed, but I don't see any discussion here. So discuss it here or link to where it was discussed please.

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I've included more info on the Clair Obscur show, including references. Please discuss before removing - my edits on this were removed, saying the references were not valid.

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than battling it in mainspace, or else it becomes an admin problem, in which case someone (usually the uncooperative/disruptive party) may be blocked or even topic banned.

1165: 1017: 983: 922: 823: 147: 2770: 2845: 1182: 1073: 1045: 1847:). The reason he is notable in Knowledge terms, like it or not, is because he is a convicted murderer, and that should be the focus of the opening paragraph - see 1032: 1010: 976: 915: 816: 587: 2795: 1113: 815:, particularly point 11. This was already discussed many times and the link was deemed inappropriate. It has been, and will continue to be, reverted on sight. 399: 1186: 2805: 2683: 1815:

Please allow this balanced historical wiki to be preserved. If you want to start another page that only talks about the bad stuff, that is your prerogative.

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Vandalism is done in malice, removing the links was not done in malice, it could have been done in ignorance (stupidity) of the reliability of the author.

200:) policy, even if it is not a biography, because it contains material about living persons. Contentious material about living persons that is unsourced or 1102: 726: 536: 2652: 2623: 212: 2401:":::Based on this small sampling, I changed your opening phrasing from "... is an American who is serving a life sentence ..." to "... is an American 1065:, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with 2810: 2780: 2672:

The following section is not cited. It should be deleted or re-written in an objective manor, since this article is in reference to a living person.

2249:, his involvement with the Manson case is the top thing they talk about. The article, both the lede and body, should reflect that." We are not here to 582: 559: 1667:

Based on this small sampling, I changed your opening phrasing from "... is an American who is serving a life sentence ..." to "... is an American

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Boby Beausoleil's filmography includes four titles, his discography eight albums. Surely that justifies describing him as an actor and musician?

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The paragraph you altered is being reverted, and your username will be submitted to wiki admin for vandalism, along with this communication.

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This article is a terrible mess, full of terrible sourcing and narrative writing style. Rather than repeat myself, please see my comments at

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unknown to the world outside of his crimes. The statement in the lead should be removed and something much more toned down used in its place.

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From 1994-2015, he has also taken part in various prison programs over the years where he was worked in video productions.

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response to whatever request to authority you make - I will go back and make further corrections to the article. Thanks.

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Knowledge promotes and supports balanced reporting. It should not be used to introduce a one-sided depiction of a subject.

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expression of malicious intent through the exclusion or undue minimizing of significant and properly sourced information.

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Would he even have a Wiki article if not for his involement with the Manson Family and his crimes as part of that group?

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https://web.archive.org/20120310050550/http://www.mansonfamilytoday.info/beausoleil-2005-parole-hearing-transcript-2.htm

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therefore applies to your previous comment. Again, don't call other person's edits vandalism unless they clearly are.

2745: 2667: 1469: 1341: 1116: 1834:. The article title is indeed Bobby Beausoleil, and his full name is Robert Kenneth Beausoleil. The point is that 1486: 1382: 1728: 1002: 965: 683: 644: 487: 448: 2600:

Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/3RRArchive388#User:Mnpie1789 reported by User:BarrelProof (Result: one week)

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the

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Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/3RRArchive387#User:Mnpie1789 reported by User:Ghmyrtle (Result: 24 hours)

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Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring#User:Mnpie1789 reported by User:Ghmyrtle (Result: 24 hours)

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https://web.archive.org/web/20160109223358/http://laist.com/2010/12/14/manson_follower_denied_parole_cant.php

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references have been added in support of acknowledging the existence of the subject’s professional history.

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Manson to hold Hinman captive at the residence and convince him to get the money before Manson arrived.

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175: 2687: 2250: 1976:, that situation is different, because "Dylan" is not a common nickname for people named "Zimmerman". — 1485:. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit 748:"He met Charlie Manson in Topanga Canyon in 1966" - Surely not. Manson was in prison until March 1967. 425: 1650:("... is an American murderer who was a central member of the 'Manson family' led by Charles Manson.") 1498: 1135: 284: 211:. If such material is repeatedly inserted, or if you have other concerns, please report the issue to 1049:

is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under

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https://web.archive.org/20081225210436/http://cbs2.com:80/local/Manson.parole.Robert.2.893254.html

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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

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before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

1293:

before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template

1198:(click on Bobby's story and Chronicles), you can easily see it is the same guy, 40 years later. 2712: 2156: 1545: 1482: 1437: 1309: 1711:

About the ongoing dispute over Beausoleil being identified as Multimedia artist and musician:

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the "Manson family". I think it is not appropriate to identify an occupation in the infobox. —

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

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If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

1315:

If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with

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The above-referenced edit warring noticeboard discussion has since been archived to

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More directly, "Dylan" is not a common nickname for people named "Zimmerman", so

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Please note that relevant discussions can also be found at the following places:

2117: 1848: 1644:("... is an American convicted murderer and former member of the Manson Family.") 1383:

http://www.mansonfamilytoday.info/beausoleil-2005-parole-hearing-transcript-2.htm

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https://bbreferencearchive.tumblr.com/post/162482353520/robert-beausoleil-resumé

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Knowledge:Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard/Archive281#Bobby Beausoleil

2012: 1953: 1659: 1517:. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than 1409:. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than 1281:. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than 1195: 2754: 2741: 2719: 2657: 2430: 2231: 2121: 2082: 2016: 1998: 1930:

https://www.interviewmagazine.com/film/web-exclusive-gaspar-noe-kenneth-anger

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Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive1006#User:Mnpie1789

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after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add

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after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add

1037: 1647: 688: 497: 492: 384: 743: 1973: 1656:("... is an American woman convicted of torturing and murdering ...") 890: 659: 638: 463: 442: 1969: 1851:. So, please revert to the previous agreed version of the text. 334:. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the 298: 263: 2057:

The noticeboard discussion has been archived, and can be found at

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http://laist.com/2010/12/14/manson_follower_denied_parole_cant.php

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to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

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to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

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There is clearly no consensus for the introduction as drafted by

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It is spam. Look at page histories for mass spam attacks and see

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Why does the opening sentence need to say "murder"/"murderer"

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from the article and its talk page, especially if potentially

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Beausoleil to be known. It's about trying to describe how he

1790:. I've reverted it again pending further discussion here. 1388:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the

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When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the

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you do not need to state that he is commonly known as Bobby

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definitely primarily notable for non-artistic activities. —

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Knowledge article constitutes fair use. In addition to the

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for additional information. I made the following changes:

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Mid-importance biography (actors and filmmakers) articles

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Knowledge requested photographs of actors and filmmakers

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would not consider the alternative name to be obvious. —

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I have just added archive links to one external link on

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http://cbs2.com/local/Manson.parole.Robert.2.893254.html

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I have just added archive links to one external link on

491:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the 2622:

I have several misgivings about the recent big edit by

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article with the subject's full, official name, be it

160: 2081:blocked from this article as a disruptive editor. 687:, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of 665: 469: 304: 15: 1521:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 1413:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 1285:using the archive tool instructions below. Editors 1092:. If you have any questions please ask them at the 884:

I will ask several authorities for their opinion...

2771:C-Class biography (actors and filmmakers) articles 596:Knowledge:WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography 2846:WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography articles 973:"Never assume malice when stupidity will suffice" 599:Template:WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography 2752: 1033:Fair use rationale for Image:Bobbybeausoleil.jpg 770:. I've asked them not to re-insert that link. 33:for general discussion of the article's subject. 2649:, i have reverted back to the previous version. 2598:Additional archived discussion may be found at 1720:http://bobbybeausoleil.com/newsroom-page-5.html 2515:Plus, Dylan also changed his first name too. " 1507:This message was posted before February 2018. 1399:This message was posted before February 2018. 1271:This message was posted before February 2018. 2796:Mid-importance biography (musicians) articles 174: 2806:Knowledge requested photographs of musicians 1960:). Please see, for example, the articles on 1477:I have just modified one external link on 1166:"Homepage of Bobby and Barbara Beausoleil" 2811:Knowledge requested photographs of people 2781:Actors and filmmakers work group articles 914:. Which authorities might you be asking? 2120:) is as a murderer, not as a musician. 583:WikiProject Crime and Criminal Biography 2563:is an American singer-songwriter ..." — 230: 2841:High-importance Crime-related articles 2791:C-Class biography (musicians) articles 2753: 1082:Knowledge:Fair use rationale guideline 948:http://www.internet.is/bret/manson.htm 1903:comprehensiveness in the information. 1812:following of fans around the world. 1122:INitial Description, Music and Acting 2407:who is serving a life sentence ..." 681:This article is within the scope of 580:This article is within the scope of 485:This article is within the scope of 320:This article is within the scope of 226: 184: 2826:High-importance California articles 2761:Biography articles of living people 1673:who is serving a life sentence ..." 23:for discussing improvements to the 13: 2856:Mid-importance Rock music articles 1036: 407: 383: 359: 14: 2872: 2011:This is now up for discussion at 1481:. Please take a moment to review 1353:. Please take a moment to review 1225:. Please take a moment to review 371:WikiProject Actors and Filmmakers 2715:) 16:12, 11 November 2023 (UTC) 2584:also the hypocorism guideline. — 2253:. This isn't a matter of how we 1080:. Using one of the templates at 701:Knowledge:WikiProject Rock music 668: 658: 637: 573: 552: 511:Knowledge:WikiProject California 472: 462: 441: 416:An editor has requested that an 307: 297: 283: 262: 231: 190:This article must adhere to the 45:Click here to start a new topic. 2861:WikiProject Rock music articles 2831:WikiProject California articles 721:This article has been rated as 704:Template:WikiProject Rock music 616:This article has been rated as 531:This article has been rated as 514:Template:WikiProject California 344:Knowledge:WikiProject Biography 2836:C-Class Crime-related articles 2816:WikiProject Biography articles 1923: 1841:which carry little weight here 1094:Media copyright questions page 347:Template:WikiProject Biography 249:It is of interest to multiple 1: 2801:Musicians work group articles 2746:19:32, 12 November 2023 (UTC) 2724:10:18, 12 November 2023 (UTC) 2439:20:00, 14 February 2019 (UTC) 2425:19:43, 14 February 2019 (UTC) 1861:21:45, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1825:21:32, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1800:13:17, 27 February 2019 (UTC) 1779:21:32, 28 February 2019 (UTC) 1759:12:44, 27 February 2019 (UTC) 1743:20:13, 16 February 2019 (UTC) 1700:20:00, 14 February 2019 (UTC) 1686:19:43, 14 February 2019 (UTC) 1629:19:11, 14 February 2019 (UTC) 1611:15:35, 12 February 2019 (UTC) 1595:19:56, 11 February 2019 (UTC) 1465:01:18, 12 February 2016 (UTC) 1063:boilerplate fair use template 695:and see a list of open tasks. 590:and see a list of open tasks. 505:and see a list of open tasks. 392:This article is supported by 368:This article is supported by 193:biographies of living persons 42:Put new text under old text. 1575:08:27, 3 November 2017 (UTC) 1140:14:43, 5 February 2009 (UTC) 1117:14:46, 30 October 2007 (UTC) 1103:13:23, 26 October 2007 (UTC) 1090:criteria for speedy deletion 1027:23:37, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 1003:21:58, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 993:21:57, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 966:21:44, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 961:Certainly seem good to me. 932:21:40, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 894:21:37, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 859:21:27, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 833:21:17, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 795:18:51, 22 January 2007 (UTC) 593:Crime and Criminal Biography 560:Crime and Criminal Biography 332:contribute to the discussion 7: 2851:C-Class Rock music articles 2821:C-Class California articles 1638:, and found the following: 1636:Category:American murderers 1337:22:34, 9 January 2016 (UTC) 779:11:33, 3 January 2007 (UTC) 761:17:13, 2 January 2007 (UTC) 205:must be removed immediately 50:New to Knowledge? Welcome! 10: 2877: 2766:C-Class biography articles 2612:22:35, 18 April 2019 (UTC) 2573:04:27, 10 April 2019 (UTC) 2388:20:55, 10 April 2019 (UTC) 2071:04:30, 23 March 2019 (UTC) 1875:17:38, 13 March 2019 (UTC) 1538:(last update: 5 June 2024) 1474:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 1430:(last update: 5 June 2024) 1371:|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} 1346:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 1302:(last update: 5 June 2024) 1243:|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} 1218:Hello fellow Wikipedians, 1074:the image description page 998:Thank you Philip I won't. 727:project's importance scale 622:project's importance scale 537:project's importance scale 2668:This section is not cited 2594:17:00, 9 April 2019 (UTC) 2558:18:09, 9 April 2019 (UTC) 2503:17:03, 9 April 2019 (UTC) 2485:00:40, 9 April 2019 (UTC) 2460:20:30, 8 April 2019 (UTC) 2362:17:56, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 2323:21:48, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 2298:18:46, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 2275:20:18, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2240:19:47, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2224:19:29, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2200:20:03, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2130:18:29, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2107:17:47, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2091:07:59, 2 April 2019 (UTC) 2051:02:26, 9 March 2019 (UTC) 2035:WP:BLP/N#Bobby Beausoleil 2025:10:26, 5 March 2019 (UTC) 2007:16:31, 4 March 2019 (UTC) 1986:18:21, 3 April 2019 (UTC) 1913:16:21, 4 March 2019 (UTC) 1580:Dispute over "occupation" 1208:18:19, 31 July 2009 (UTC) 1187:16:17, 31 July 2009 (UTC) 1076:and edit it to include a 1046:Image:Bobbybeausoleil.jpg 720: 653: 615: 568: 530: 457: 415: 391: 367: 292: 257: 80:Be welcoming to newcomers 2696:03:20, 26 May 2019 (UTC) 2153:affirming the consequent 1160:23:50, 12 May 2015 (UTC) 1055:explanation or rationale 813:Knowledge:External links 768:User_talk:165.228.131.12 2662:05:03, 8 May 2019 (UTC) 2641:04:33, 8 May 2019 (UTC) 2169:argument from ignorance 2145:argument from authority 1470:External links modified 1342:External links modified 1214:External links modified 2157:denying the antecedent 1041: 684:WikiProject Rock music 602:Crime-related articles 488:WikiProject California 412: 388: 364: 239:This article is rated 75:avoid personal attacks 2173:WP:right great wrongs 1057:as to why its use in 1040: 766:The discussion is at 411: 395:WikiProject Musicians 387: 363: 323:WikiProject Biography 275:Actors and Filmmakers 100:Neutral point of view 2618:Edit by Griffdawg567 2230:opening sentence. 1519:regular verification 1411:regular verification 1396:to let others know. 1357:. If necessary, add 1283:regular verification 1268:to let others know. 1229:. If necessary, add 105:No original research 2251:WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS 1509:After February 2018 1401:After February 2018 1392:parameter below to 1273:After February 2018 1264:parameter below to 707:Rock music articles 517:California articles 2341:(22–25 March 2019) 2261:known, relying on 2165:circular reasoning 1563:InternetArchiveBot 1514:InternetArchiveBot 1406:InternetArchiveBot 1278:InternetArchiveBot 1078:fair use rationale 1042: 413: 389: 365: 350:biography articles 245:content assessment 86:dispute resolution 47: 2726: 2702:Description redux 2698: 2682:comment added by 2429:Seems OK to me. 2149:appeal to emotion 1690:Seems OK to me. 1642:Leslie Van Houten 1539: 1463: 1431: 1335: 1303: 1177:comment added by 1162: 1150:comment added by 741: 740: 737: 736: 733: 732: 676:Rock music portal 632: 631: 628: 627: 547: 546: 543: 542: 480:California portal 436: 435: 432: 431: 225: 224: 183: 182: 66:Assume good faith 43: 2868: 2716: 2677: 1950: 1932: 1927: 1573: 1564: 1537: 1536: 1515: 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