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891:, although if you mean remove the various crusades I agree with that too 3) On removing 1241 I agree, could live without Ireland and Armada if that was the consensus 4) The Holy Leagues article is a disambig, if this was expanded I agree 5) Agree 6) Agree, but think Sicilian Vespers is better as it is wider and includes Aragonese.
704:
etc. There is no generic Holy
Leagues article the creation of which would solve the possible issue of listing them individually. Don't know why you would write that Ideology and Instituitions should be at the bottom, but equally wouldn't be able to make a case it should be at the top where it is. The
515:
It's a question of what this navbox is supposed to achieve. I suggest it should help in navigating between the articles directly connected to the topic of "crusades". Template creep is a real problem, in this case, the natural tendency will be to list each and every article loosely connected to
597:
Well, the older version listed
Mallorca, Aragonese and the Sicilian Vespers as Italian crusades! Or at least that is how it appeared. None of them were. In fact, the Aragonese was listed twice. That is why I changed it. But you are right that the heading is not good enough.
653:
I just looked at the
Campaign Box, and it seems that it's gotten out of control with all the dates. In my mind, it should be a quick reference, not a detailed view. I would suggest deleting the dates unless a crusade is identified solely by the date (e.g., 1197). Other
950:, but I agree that that is not ideal. My only concerns with these changes are that now some articles with crusade in the very title are not in the box (e.g., the popular crusades). In separate edits, I also removed two minor actions that I don't think belong here.
826:
It is an interesting conundrum. It is not clear what the criteria for inclusion in this campaign box is, and certainly there has not been a established consesnsus on this. Equally, there the definition of crusade is neither clear nor agreed.
567:—I think your recent edit has confused the headings. Previously, the info box differentiated political/Italian crusades and crusades against heretics and schismatics which is a common structure for the topic. These are now grouped as
988:
Difficult to justify some of the smaller crusades while also lumping all the Holy
Leagues together under one heading. Previously, I thought otherwise but the Campaign Box now gives undue weight to a number of minor conflicts.
752:
It is not possible for this box to include every single campaign that was declared a crusade. When nothing in the article mentions it (e.g., Ireland), it isn't important enough for the box. Also, why the War of the
Vespers?
523:
The
Reconquista is a major topic in its own right, which is of course intimately connected to the Crusades. It probably still isn't helpful to expand the scope of this infobox to include the Reconquista.
946:
I agree with all 6 of
Grampinator's proposals and have implemented them. This meant removing Vespers and keeping Aragonese, which is also my preference. I also put in the dab link to
146:
63:
800:
The Irish article has no reference to crusades. The question isn't whether it fits the definition, technically or otherwise, but whether or not it belongs in a navigational box. The
348:
Not really possible (and it would probably cause alignment problems in cases where the box did actually follow a full infobox, if we added it). On the other hand, though, if
382:
One point of interest: I used short-form links here (e.g. ]), since that's the general convention in most campaignboxes. I don't know if this is too confusing here, though.
453:
Launched in response to
Frederick I's failure in the Third. I have created the article and have used a very good referece, so please check it out. I have also added it in.
199:
But it's not a single conflict with a bunch of campaigns or battles, like campaignboxes usually contain. Although I suppose we could make a box to make it look like one...
726:
Right you are on
Ireland and Spanish Armada. I wouldn't regard the latter as a Crusade against Heretics but rather Later Crusades (1291–1578). Maybe a single reference
775:, who funded these campaigns, who authorised these campaigns, provided papal banners and excommunicated QEI. As for Sicilian Vespers Tyerman for one writes of them
492:
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was initiated when
Frederick of Sicily (1296-1337) younger son of Peter III, refused to surrender the island to the Angevins. Only the treaty of Caltabellota in
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855:(1) Delete the dates unless that's the name of the Crusade (e.g., 1101), but include the dates in the major heading, e.g., "In the Holy Land (1096–1291)
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397:"In 1480, without cause or warning , the Turkish fleet invaded and landed nearby and took the city and its fort. The Pope called for a crusade,..."
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Taken as a whole this changes would greatly increase the readability and utility of this campaign box, as well as moving thge various debates at
591:
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319:
Ok, I converted it, but it's hidden at the moment...is there any way to include an image, or is that just not a possible field in a campaignbox?
419:
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isn't broken into subsections. As to the heading in the Infobox, I would suggest "Other crusades in Europe" or "Related crusades in Europe".
487:
Surely the Reconquista deserves a mention in the box? It's not a Crusade as such, but it was a war of Religion, so I think it qualifies.
632:
There isn't a 100% match as some of the crusades can be in multiple places. I'm not sure it really matters as 4.0 Other crusades in
539:
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867:(5) Possibly have "Reconquista" with no subentries, as those are more along the lines of battles rather than sub-Crusades
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571:. This overlaps with other headings where Crusades are grouped thematically e.g. reconquista, Northern and some of the
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88:. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a
928:
Wouldn't want to tempt fate, but unless there are any late incoming objections it certainly looks like it.
415:
294:
for consistency?). I just wanted to make sure that there wouldn't be an angry mob on my hands afterwards.
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Anti-Mongol crusade is misplaced as it was in 1241, not after 1291. It probably doesn't belong in the box.
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870:(6) Probably don't need both "Sicilian Vespers" and "Aragonese", and I would go with the latter.
964:
Looks an improvement, I removed the italics from Reconquista as well as they seemed exceptional
852:
Regardless, I think it's clear that the navigational box has gotten too busy. Some thoughts:
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Based on this, disregard my (6) above. Could we be approaching a rare moment of consensus?
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to Tyerman and he also mentions Ireland in Murray, Gods War and England and the Crusades.
700:—wouldn't see a problem with losing the dates, the insignificant 1267 and Mongol crusade,
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Not sure if anyone watches this page directly, but I suppose it doesn't hurt to ask...
379:
Well, I've changed it to a campaignbox format; let's see what kind of comments we get.
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is added at the top of the articles using this, an image can be included there.
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669:"War of the Sicilian Vespers 1282-1302" should simply be "Sicilian Vespers"
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Oh, yeah, I guess so. So it should be pretty simple to change this one?
951:
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Holy Leagues deserve mention but I'm not sure where and to what detail.
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No, it doesn't. As you yourself say, it's not a crusade. Case closed.
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format? It would make it much easier to include in conjunction with
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785:, which left Sicily in Aragonese hands, ended the Sicilian crusades
633:
864:(4) Move "Holy Leagues" as a single entree under "Later Crusades"
516:
military campaigns by Catholic states, to the point of including "
426:
The question you have to ask is "is this campaign widely known as
861:(3) Delete "Anti-Mongol 1241," "Ireland" and "Spanish Armada."
175:
Might it be possible to reformat this template in the standard
284:
instead of the regular table markup (and probably moved to
206:
We have a lot of them now that list a series of wars (e.g.
434:
ever been used in connection with it, ever, by anyone". --
76:
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inclusion of the Armada is supported by a citation in
544:
These were missing so I added them chronologically.
678:Ideology and Institutions should be at the bottom.
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274:Very much so; it just needs to be changed to use
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887:1) Agree 2) Not sure what you mean by collapse
575:where geographically the crusades were also
663:Is 1267 significant enough to be included?
82:This template is within the scope of the
32:does not require a rating on Knowledge's
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1013:Template-Class military history articles
804:section, for example, could be expanded
612:On this basis I have restored the title
767:The article to which Ireland wikilinks
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430:in historiography", not "has the term
102:Knowledge:WikiProject Military history
92:. To use this banner, please see the
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38:It is of interest to the following
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