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915:. On going through this in detail, there are perhaps three sentences to add to Pirogue from this article. (The tree species used for the sailing versions, the "lakana" is the Malagasy for pirogue, and that this word applies to dug out canoes, with or without outriggers and with various rigs. We cannot say more as the sailing rigs are incompletely described by sources.) Lakana would just remain as a redirect.
79:
647:". Which is supported by Richardson in particular. Yes, the article mentions different types of rigging. But I don't read it as stating that the rigging type is part of the definition/classification. If that is unclear, I would suggest that we clarify or change the text. Rather than delete the article.
702:
with the caption "Miandry ny lakana miampita" which google translates as "The boat is waiting to cross". We can see there is no outrigger. (Whilst OR is not allowed for article content, there is no prohibition on using it to help understand a subject.) The boat in the video is very different from the
539:
which has a translation provided by a colonial administrator confirming that "lakana" is not a specific type of canoe, but a canoe (or boat) in general. Hornell is still seen as a useful authority on the ethnography of sailing craft in the areas in which he worked. If the word applied to a particular
723:
article – but there is no RS that identifies the rig type. And, of course, Commons has no obligation for its descriptions of pictures to be supported by an RS. This might contribute to the impetus for deletion in this editor's mind (as proposer), as there is a very common class of
Madagascan dugout
505:
presents this term as representing a specific type of watercraft (an outrigger canoe) with a specific type of rig (the "downwind" mastless rig that is supported between two sprits). This specific type of craft does exist – it is shown in the photo illustrating the article. However, in
Malagasy, as
698:
Translation: The key issue is whether Lakana is a term for "outrigger canoes which are based on a dugout hull" or if it applies to "any dugout canoe". The two sources discussed above seem to give the definition of an unqualified "dugout canoe". At present the article is solely about the outrigger
546:
with no result. Therefore, I think we have to conclude that these concerns about the article are correct. If "lakana" is a much broader term than the article suggests, if we do not the name of the type of craft that the article describes (I can find no source that makes this clear), then the only
550:
In passing, it is worth saying that I have come to the conclusion that though the subject of traditional sailing craft in
Madagascar would make a very interesting (to me) article on Knowledge, there simply are not sufficient sources to do the subject justice. This is after some considerable
766:". Effectively, yes, I think that's probably the most appropriate outcome. Retain the title. As a redirect. And summarise and merge the content/text (about the Lakana being a form of Pirogue/dugout traditionally associated with Madagascar) into the
650:
Sources. To my mind, there are sufficient sources (including the two above) to support some text about the subject. Being a type of dugout outrigger traditionally used in
Madagascar. Even if just as a sub-set / sub-section of the
506:
far as I can determine, the word "Lakana" is any type of canoe, with or without outriggers, with or without a sailing rig, and certainly not confined to just one type of sailing rig. This is clear from the reference in the article
658:
Suggested action. If the issues with the title are scope (including clarity of the text) or sources (reflecting them), I'm not sure that outright deletion is the right way to go. Deletion isn't cleanup. At the very least, a
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for these Vezo craft under sail, which is something that most believe
Hornell never saw). All I have to back this thought up is some private correspondence with a researcher on Austronesian rigs – so essentially
471:
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My interpretation: Can't access these sources, but the
Knowledge wording suggests that there are similar craft elsewhere - i.e. there's nothing peculiar to Madagascar about these.
795:
My take on the current sources etc. is that none of them indicate that the lakana is anything other than the
Malagasy for a canoe. My interpretation of each source etc. below:
209:. If you want to nominate an article for deletion, go through the process on that page before adding it to this page. To add a discussion to this page, follow these steps:
119:
739:. That would fit with the intent behind the proposal: that we do not really have enough sourced material for an article on the Lakana on its own. Have I got this correct?
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to the top of the list. Replace "PageName" with the relevant article name, i.e. the one on the existing AFD discussion. Also, indicate the title of the article in the
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to it, which will inform editors that it has been listed here. You may place this tag above or below the nomination statement or at the end of the discussion thread.
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article. Which appears to cover the "generic" class of small dugout canoe. Globally. With a redirect left behind. To a subsection on the
Madagascan type.
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as it is particularly helpful to add a link to the article in the edit summary. When you save the page, the discussion will automatically appear.
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713:, pg 40, fig 21, drawing B) that is not described, in Madagascar, by Hornell or anyone else. (Hornell describes this rig in the neighbouring
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643:) that the Lakana is (yes) a specific type of watercraft. Being an outrigger canoe. That is "dug out". Rather than "built". IE: A "
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Scope. To my read, the article doesn't state (at least not directly as interpreted by the nominator) that the article "
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for general information about
Articles for Deletion, including a list of article deletions sorted by day of nomination.
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correctly, their suggestion would mean a complete rewrite of the article to fit the sources and then merge it into
453:
806:"The boat is often referred to by the general French term "pirogue", which can include boats with no outriggers."
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presents this term as representing a specific type of watercraft (an outrigger canoe ) with a specific type of rig
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Hornell, James (September 1920). “The Common Origin of the
Outrigger Canoes of Madagascar and East Africa”
814:“The technology was adapted in neighboring East Africa, like the Tanzanian ngalawa and the Fulani laana.”
793:(Note: prior to the AfD nomination, I had suggested to the nominator that they put this up for deletion.)
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suggestion would mean a complete rewrite of the article to fit the sources and then merge it into Pirogue
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this is the second AfD nomination for Lakana, but the first related to a company not a type of boat.
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798:"The lateen rig allows a lakana to sail closer to the wind, so giving some windward performance.”
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outrigger canoe that is totally undescribed in RSs, so making the subject incomplete. (See youtube
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822:“some locals prefer the Hazomalany wood (Hazomalania voyronii of the family of Hernandiaceae).”
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make use of outrigger canoes with a distinctive common spritsail rig (as defined by Edwin Doran
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etc.) related to Ethnic groups. For the other XfD's, the process is the same as AfD (except
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My interpretation: “general French term” suggests there's nothing special about the lakana.
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Richardson, J (December 1887). “The Affinities Of Malagasy With The Melanesian Languages”
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My interpretation: Only indicates that “lakana” is simply the Malagasy for “canoe”.
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My interpretation: Only indicates that “lakana” is simply the Malagasy for “canoe”.
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I'm stiking your duplicate vote. Your nomination statement is your Delete vote.
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My interpretation: Doesn't indicate that the lakana is something different.
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My interpretation: Doesn't indicate that the lakana is something different.
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My interpretation: Doesn't indicate that the lakana is something different.
182:
This is a collection of discussions on the deletion of articles related to
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version. To assist in decision-making on the meaning, see this video
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Archived discussions (starting from September 2007) may be found at:
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Adding an AfD to this page does not add it to the main page at
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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searching. (It would be great to be proved wrong in this.)
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option is to delete the article as unsupported by sources.
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hull and rig combination, he would have picked up on this.
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What makes this more difficult is the knowledge that the
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specific type of watercraft (a dugout outrigger canoe )
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194:. Anyone can help maintain the list on this page.
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Closed AfD discussions are automatically removed by
964:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
890:Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,
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I have asked for help on the Wikiproject Madagascar
323:WikiProject Deletion sorting/Ethnic groups/archive
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584:Note: This discussion has been included in the
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758:. Hi
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448:books
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415:watch
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132:Today
67:To-do
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