Knowledge:Wikiquette assistance/archive22

148:

not going to give. For the record - I'm not a suck up and I didn't come here to make friends, so if someone takes offense to how I handle things thats their problem not mine. Your all anonymous to me, this isn't a paying job and I'm not trying to win kudos for a higher position of authority like being an admin or whatever - so if there are a bunch of incidents stacked against me so be it. I really don't care. Therefore, when I'm accused of something I'll respond however I feel is necessary and if that includes smart ass comments and sarcasm then thats what happens. All I can say is that Cheeser needs to get over it because I really don't give a shit if he/she has an issue with me or not. Cheeser accuses me of saying "I own these articles" well I'd like to see where I said that. The copyright vio banner is something that can't be ignored unless you want to see the article annihilated. Yeah, I could have let the article go, but knowing full well no one else will lift a finger to fix it, it would of course get the admin "quick fix" and be deleted entirely. Because I spent time on it, I get pissed when I see work I did flushed down the drain because someone out there doesn't like it or thinks it violates something. I never said I owned the articles I work on nor did I say anyone else wasn't allowed to touch them. But whatever, this is the first time in the four years I been on Knowledge where anyone's lodged a complaint against me - I think the record shows that I'm a civil person but I do have a short fuse for morons.

2623:

clash frequently on many pages. They seem to argue most about the relationship of the UK monarchy with other Commonwealth monarchies: in particular, the Canadian one. In my opinion TharkunColl does seem to ignore some points and sometimes offers (in my opinion) irrational arguments. But on that score you could castigate many of not most editors at some point or another. On the other hand, if you stay with him long enough and patiently enough, he will address your points. G2Bambino, in his discussions with TharkunColl seems to assume motive and resorts sometimes to personal attacks. He also on occasion ignores valid points TharkunColl makes. They are both red rags to each other, as many talk pages show. I think this issue is more about a personal feud. Both parties are equally responsible for disruptions. I agree with GoodDay: if you read a lengthy exchange them, they actually agree on more than they argue about. And yes, following another good idea from GoodDay, why don't you (Tharky and G2) both retire temporarily from the UK vs equal monarchy thing and see how it plays out without you? You might be able to get some fresh perspective. --

4080:. Here, he instigated an edit-war by removing a large amount of entries without discussion. I never reverted him, though other editors did, and he engaged in edit-war like behavior with them. Attempting to find good faith, prevent an escalation of the edit-war, and improve the article, I attempted to engage him in discussion. Instead of taking this opportunity to improve the article, he instead nominated the article for deletion, on the pretexts that inclusion criteria (which I was attempting to discuss with him) were poorly defined, and that this had caused an edit-war (which he had started). I realize he has done some good in the work on English municipalities, but even here it seems that he is taking advantage of the rules-- articles on towns cannot be deleted as non-notable-- in order to spin out hundreds of stub articles. I have serious doubts about the validity of his purposes in editing here. 354:

arrogant jerk who likes to fan the pages of policy in my face like I don't know them and from what I read in your little essay about how Knowledge fails when it comes to enforcing it's policies, you seem all for running this place like a gestapo camp. Now that you caught me you just don't wanna let go because you want to make an example out of me. I have news for you — you aren't Knowledge's guardian knight, you're not a policy superhero. I've wasted enough of my day on this stupidity so I am done with this discussion. As far as I can see there's nothing to resolve except your arrogance and "can do no wrong" attitude — and I can't help you with that. So, I'd appreciate if you got off my back. If you're on some sort of crusade to straighten me out then you're wasting your time. You have a lovely evening now.

3357:. What you say in reference to him may very well be the case, that he had less than honorable motives in his edits to the various articles involved. However, what I was referring to you when I mentioned the concept of AGF was the portion of your response referring to Enuja's motives in opening a WQA. I don't see her behavior at all deserving of a re-examination of her motives; and to see it in that light would really require you to have dropped your good-faith assumption about her behavior a while ago. I'm not just tooting a policy horn, here—I really believe that AGF is what greases the wheels of Knowledge's operations, so to speak. When we start seeing ulterior motives behind every editor, then we spend more time addressing our paranoia and less time improving the encyclopedia. -- 4076:

to all other editors. He follows what he feels are Knowledge rules with rigid literalism, usually as an excuse to mass-nominate articles in a subject area for deletion. These mass-deletions always follow his loss of an article through AfD. Once he has lost an article, he goes on a deletion-tagging rampage, invariably showing contempt for consensus and an inhumanely literalistic interpretation of the rules, apparently to prove a point. When his actions cause an outcry from editors with long experience in those subjects, and administrators offering him advice, he refuses to budge, and instead increases the rate of his nominations. My most recent such encounter with him was at the

3573:. I think you're allowing Tony1 to get under your skin a little too much - I'm referring specifically to where you cited Godwin's Law and told him that he'd lost the argument. While I agree that his calling you a Nazi was way out of line and generally discredits his arguments, you allowed yourself to respond in kind, thus inflaming the situation more. (Telling someone that they're losing usually only prompts them to fight harder.) I think you'd be better served by refocusing the discussion only to the policies at hand, and politely asking the other editor to remove all personal attacks from his comments and focus on the content discussion. 3849: 3440: 1106: 920: 437: 2659:

enough, and treat him with respect, he will respond to your arguments. I'd suggest simply rely on the safeguards Wiki already has in place (the 3 revert block rule, etc)to deal with difficulties, and most importantly, don't respond in a personal manner. As youve read from my comments to Tharky, I get riled by him, but it is important to keep my cool. When I stopped feeling riled, I noticed he put forward some bloody good points that made me think. I will of course, continue to spar with him. It's all good fun, as long as noone gets hurt! Cheers!--

3170:, and the bulk of the information can be moved to the most appropriate article where someone who wants to find out about the relation between mass and weight will logically look first. Nothing is lost by doing this, since it's just a simple click away. Personally, I enjoy the aspect of being able to open linked articles in a new tab for additional information when I'm done perusing the first article. The exploration of additional linked articles is part of what makes Knowledge fun to learn from! 31: 2451:

article and changes it in line with his views/normal rather than convoluted views. These are in effect content disputes between these two editors in particular, over a range of articles with themes about the commonwealth etc. G2Bambino has been blocked for 3RR for this himself in the past over this. From what Lonewolf said above, as you can see I am not the only one with this opinion about the ongoing G2B vs tharkie issues. Call it a 'personality clash' or a clash of agendas/POVs.

4493:(note: this one is not included on the list). All these antagonisitc, non-constructive comments, the result is undeniably to sour the AfD process and make it impossible to work together to discuss policy and work to form consensus on the issue. Instead, these bad-faith AfD nomimations are marked with continued acts of unreasonable and uncivil behavior. It seems entirely inappropriate to respond condescendingly, or at least non-constructively, to every single "keep" vote. He even 3305:

life and liberty. This is not a civil trial where liability to the tune of millions of dollars is established based upon the “preponderance of evidence.” For the purposes of interacting with other editors on Knowledge, only one common-sense test can apply: treat others as you would have them treat you and assume good faith until they demonstrate otherwise. Once someone has violated that trust and does childish stuff, the “presumption of good faith” is no longer deserved.

3203:, or perhaps consider RFC or a vote. I am also deeply concerned by your comment, regardless of the circumstances, that you " interested in what ... regular editors feel." Regardless of the size of the group of editors expressing a concern, how often they contribute to the article in question or scientific subject matters, or how experienced they are at Knowledge, you should always be interested in what your fellow editors have to say. That's the basis of 607:) have kind of given up. I doubt mediation would work, as she has consistently ignored others' opinions. Ideally I'd like to resolve this editorially (not administratively), but it's been hard (I've even been resisting putting up 3RR reports and just asking for page protection so it wouldn't be interpreted as me trying to administratively sanction her personally). But, to be honest, I'm at my wits' end. I'd be interested in posting something on 1894:. He created and actively edits the article, but I stepped in to try to improve the page. Since then, he's fought me left and right on edits. The reason I bring this issue here is that we had a discussion over what to name the section that refers to the discontinue flavors. I went ahead and got a third opinion that seemed reasonable and went ahead and made the edits, and he reverted them and left a fairly inflammatory comment on the 2645:

occasions. Thark's reasons for elevating the UK in every and all instances – the non-UK countries are colonies, they are "non-kingdoms," they have vice-regals, and so on – certainly were not accepted. It's the fact that Thark refuses to recognise these decisions, and, of course, any of the provided evidence that supports them, combined with the aggressive reverting, and NPOV and NPA breaches, that makes Thark generally disruptive.

3158:

and valuable but misplaced information is relocated. You compared the article on Kilogram to a Britannica article, and said "it's nowhere near as long" and "Britannica articles have some depth." The beauty of Knowledge (and the World Wide Web and hypertext in general) is that you don't have to have all of the information on one page for the article (and the encyclopedia) to have depth. If the information is moved to, say,

2346:

annoyance, and general editing of articles to suit his POV. He calls for discussion on talk pages but often refuses to answer direct questions, hardly ever provides citations, and derides other people's citations as irrelevent or out of context. He instigates disruption on articles by inserting his POV, leading to edit wars and article locking. Almost every article he has altered in this way has been subject to disruption.

3984:

see his point, that if he just goes and fixes the problems himself, the fixes may not necessarily gain the notice of the original editor, and thus the original editor may just go make the same mistakes later on, requiring more fixes. I believe his intentions were good in promoting the "fix it yourself" approach - wording could have been a little better, but I don't see any clear violations of civility here. —

1923:- and reading between the lines I can certainly see a possible ownership issue there. However, before I can comment on it, I'd need to see some diffs in which he reverted your edits for the sole apparent reason of protecting "his" version of the page (i.e. without making reference to policy or otherwise justifying his reversions). Once I see those, I may be able to discuss the issue with him. 2825: 2053: 1883: 73: 4196:- please refrain from making such remarks. It is okay to say that you feel as though you're being stalked (though I doubt that's what's happening in this case), but when you start judging other people's character like you did above ("He's just a schoolkid, though"), it can be quite insulting to other users, and it only tends to inflame the situation further, rather than helping. — 4581:. Regardless, this is way out of hand. I believe something needs to be done. I may have more to add later, but I am fairly busy and may not be able to find the time. But this is what I've come up with now, in a bit of spare time I had this evening. Of course, there are also plenty of other users making points that I have not covered here (like Xhir's point about Epbr trying to 799:. These are important policies that discuss not only how to stay out of trouble, but also how to be more effective in arguing your points in content disputes. Also keep in mind that if your arguments are against current consensus, the onus is on you to sway the consensus through civilized discussion and official sources that back up your point of view. Also keep in mind 2690: 1186:, so that is not an acknowledgement of incivility.) If so, I should just suck this up, or remove the few India-related pages I edit from my watchlist? On the other hand, if, as I think, Bakasuprman's comments are outside the bounds of civility, I'd appreciate it if someone else would let him know; he doesn't seem too inclined to accept my input. 4375:, just a few paragraphs above, calling me a "stalker" and a "schoolkid" in order to discredit my complaints against him. Interesting that his condescending "schoolmaster" approach was the initial reason this WQA was opened (although it's widened quite a bit in its scope since then). He nominated 11 articles for deletion in a single day, from 757:

along with consensus is another matter - they are valid, and nobody is trying to tell you that they're not. What is NOT okay is the fact that you are personally attacking Dali-Llama (DL), and have been shown to do so in the past. By criticizing DL's use of the English and/or Portuguese languages, questioning her age (both of which are

3228:, and no consensus was needed on that from the RFC. I suspect she opened the RFC to see if there was consensus to support YOUR view that the information should remain in Kilogram, since you seemed upset by the idea of moving it, and if such a consensus had formed, then I believe she'd have left the information intact in Kilogram. 2328:

TharkunColl's attitude with him would be sufficient for him to take a second look at himself; yes, multiple warnings and blocks seem to have done little, but maybe - just maybe - a frank opinion expressed to him might work (?). If that does fail, then said other editor could thus be the second person required to file an RfC/U. --

2775:

creating a sub-article on the earlier controversies about body count. That is certainly more in line with the expectations from the encyclopaedia; the media battle and the real-world battle were two different things. If nothing else, I find that focusing on too many things at once on a talkpage can lead to extra frustration.

85:

some sort of spite that I apparently harbor. I asked him twice to discontinue his inappropriate behavior and to assume good faith, until he insisted that he was not violating policy, but rather "add more flavor" to the discussion. This is a relatively minor dispute, but this user's behavior seems to be in gross violation of

3224:. There was indeed a lack of consensus from the RFC on keeping the information on mass vs. weight directly in the article. A lack of consensus doesn't necessarily mean that there will be a lack of action. Enuja's attempt to move the detailed information to the specific subject article(s) was supported already by 1853:

common values, one must try to go to arbitration where meaningful sanctions can be enforced. One of this group, Bharatveer, has been taken directly to arbitration for similar behavior, and of course "Baka" has taken his usual combative approach in supporting him there. I suggest reviewing the arbitration case

803:, which deals with the issue of putting undue weight on one particular point of view - in cases where POV statements are appropriate for an article (such as in movie reviews), it is important to keep the article balanced such that it accurately reflects all relevant points of view, not just a single one. 3645:

appears to be equally true of both you and I, and Radiant, and... So I wouldn't put too much store in that. I do agree that he also does calm down. So, I'm not sure why we are here. His over-the-top "like a Nazi" comment got him admonished by multiple parties, and I'm sure that's sufficient. Also,

3696:

I do wish someone would look into Pmanderson's behavior as part of this whole issue; I can't help but notice he's lodged what I consider to be a spurious issue two sections below this one, and suggest that someone might ask Pmanderson to consider his own editing style and the effect it has on others.

3294:

good faith). It is inescapable that humans often behave in ways that are clearly childish or not in good faith. People can do bad things. Knowledge can experience its share of all of this; you can I both know this. Any reasonable interpretation of, for instance, Yath’s behavior in following me to the

2622:

If I can offer an observation: I respect both TharkunColl and G2bambino as editors who do their research and offer useful comments. I have been in lengthy discussions with both of them. I have both agreed and disagreed with them on a number of points. From what I've observed G2bambino and TharkunColl

1722:

This thread is making me wonder about this noticeboard's utility. Instead of getting outside comment about the issues at hand, this thread is simply offering Bakasuprman another venue to cast aspersions on my character, credibility, etc. If we're not going to get any comments from uninvolved parties,

1586:

is an official policy in Knowledge. You are not permitted to throw around accusations of virulent bigotry. If virulent bigotry is impacting upon articles, you must deal with that through appropriate channels, and not by just making personal attacks on the bigot. If a virulent bigot is making personal

765:

and other civility policies. This behavior tends to discredit your own arguments, but more importantly, it also inflames other users, usually causing knock-down-drag-out arguments that can span multiple pages and cause many hard feelings on all sides. At that point, the discussions stop being about

625:

and the reason why you warned her about it, among other things. I have been trying very hard to get her to separate the behavior and content issues, and I'm personally getting rather frustrated by the ongoing discussion there. One or two more exchanges like the ones we've been having, and I'm going

4728:

had alerted him to my (completely appropriate, I still believe) reversions to his deletions on his talk page, but obviously I'm not surprised. (And yes, I gathered that Picaroon was an admin, which is why I let it be without engaging in further efforts. Why bother trying to do the right thing when

4075:

I've had several encounters with Epbr123, and will share some impressions, for what they're worth. His behavior in the English municipality and FA articles and discussions show him, by far, at his most constructive. Once he leaves these areas he is unceasingly arrogant, condescending and destructive

3983:

In my opinion, he has a valid point, even if it could have been stated more politely. It is a little condescending as written, and generally editors are encouraged to just fix obvious problems, as that is more efficient and helps promote the constructive and cooperative nature of a wiki. But I can

3934:

OT:That has been my interpretation of the FAC process, that the reviewers primarily were concerned with presentation clarity, not so much the content (though if it stinks, they point it out). But most articles should be close to not having content issues to be serious FAC contenders I would think.

3919:

Actually, I did think Epbr's responses were less than helpful, but perhaps that's to be expected since the discussion in question started with a severe critique of the FAC process. Ironically enough, Epbr's responses could easily be seen as a demonstration of one of PMAnderson's criticisms--that the

3304:

So in that particular case, considering the totality of the history preceding that, a simple common-sense test shows he very probably went looking for conflict with a provocative deletion. This is not a court of law where the burden of proof must be “beyond a reasonable doubt” before society revokes

2728:

removed the tags saying that "factuality has been established and there's no massive neutrality issues. feel free to open the issues on talk in separete subsections." (Actually, that's another issue here - Jaakobou has been aggressively trying to structure the discussion to his liking, moving around

2658:

Rather than being disruptive I would say Tharky pushes his point. You could call that a strength as long as his arguments are supported by evidence. And he does put evidence forward, no matter how much we may dispute its worth. And I agree, it can be annoying. But as I say, if you stay with him long

2593:

His talk page and block log are evidence enough, and both show he gets himself in trouble well enough without my help. I've already admitted that I'm no saint, but I think the main difference between he and I is that I can be reasoned with. I don't know if others have, but I've tried to reason with

2567:

You've provided no evidence yourself, though, it's just wingeing. Please provide diffs of what you claim he has done wrong, and no doubt dozens could be provided as examples of your bizarre behaviour too. My point is that tharkie might be stendentious but you are too. I don't have to defend thark

2516:

The situaton can be assessed by G2B's own words "Yes, I considered RfC/U, however a minimum two people who have already previously contacted the user in question regarding his/her behaviour is required to file one. I currently have no such counterpart. Hence, I wanted to bring his actions to wider

1852:

Bakasuprman is one of what appears to be an affinity group of users with similar ideas and open contempt for wikipedian standards (read their talk pages and editing history), who often support each other. IMHO, it is a waste of time to consider mediation with such repeat, unrepentant users who share

1359:

Presenting past evidence of your incivility is hardly grinding an axe on this page. (Thank you for linking to that evidence, by the way.) Both dab's comments you've linked to indicate that you are considered a single purpose account; that in itself is not incivil. I still await substantiation of the

883:

That's what's frustrated me in this case. She repeatedly threatened me with a "block", and I told her several times to contact an administrator or log a complaint in any of the DR forums, like RFC or AN/I and she refused to do so. And the recalcitrant nature of her actions in two projects now really

407:

I am glad this has come to a positive conclusion. I've left a more extensive response on my talk page (since the more extensive comment from Cyberia was there). I had begun to lose hope that this would come to a positive resolution, but since it has, there's no reason to continue this process to any

4585:

a page in the middle of an AfD he started for that page). Oh, and one more point: he lists every single one of his edits as "minor." Many people filter out minor edits, and he would effectively be able to edit without being noticed by these people. He could respond to their points, appropriately or

4321:

In addition to engaging in mass deletions (and refusing to explain why), edit warring, refusing to try to discuss things out, mass related AfD creation without grouping them together (in order to increase their chances of succeeding), and then calling an AfD in bad faith as he was clearly losing an

3299:

article looking to create conflict, would lead to the conclusion that this wasn’t in good faith. As I explained above in the third paragraph of my statement, his motives are unprovable, known only to him and God. I’ve carefully studied the timing of the edits he made to the article and his posts to

3157:

Knowledge would not be where it is today without contributors like you, Greg, who take the time and effort to improve our coverage of scientific topics. However, Knowledge would also not be where it is without editors like Enuja, who take the time to ensure that each article covers what it should,

2774:

Much of the discussion is based on who called it a massacre and when. This is not really relevant to an encyclopaedia article on a battle, which should focus on current knowledge of strategies used and casualties; as a method of defusing tension, I strongly suggest you all take a break and consider

2345:

The problem here is G2bambino's obsessive pushing of a certain POV across all pages relating to the British monarchy. This complaint here is part of a pattern of disruption that includes excessive arguing on talk pages, using all possible administrative processes (such as this one) to cause further

2327:

Yes, I considered RfC/U, however a minimum two people who have already previously contacted the user in question regarding his/her behaviour is required to file one. I currently have no such counterpart. Hence, I wanted to bring his actions to wider attention. Hopefully another editor discussing

1974:

I've left a note on his talk page encouraging him to accept the change (which I personally think is clearly more in keeping with Knowledge's policies than is "Flavor graveyard", although I'm not here to adjudicate content disputes). I've also asked him to confirm that, if an RFC results in a clear

1738:

Personally, I agree. It's apparent by the ongoing argument here and the fact that Duae Quartunciae's comments above about civility policies were almost completely ignored, that continued discussion on this board will probably not accomplish much. We can only help mediate when all parties involved

1428:

It stands to note that the only two editors pressing the issue are editors that wish me banned and have broken Wiki rules multiple times to attempt to do so. Masquerading as a "concerned user" and presenting oneself as a victim really adds an emotional touch. "Bakasuprman is a demon that deals with

1414:

Sad, and true. Note that Bakasuprman has indicated nothing in the above statement except that he believes that these concerns about civility are the product of 'misrepresentation'. And as for being exposed to incivility, all of us face trolling regularly. As I pointed out earlier, trolling by anons

1360:

claim that Baksuprman is exposed to incivility on a daily basis. He is not; judging by the comments on this page, he seems to labour under a delusion that he is being persecuted by a cabal of tendentious editors and racist admins. Such a delusion is not a basis for the abandonment of a core policy.

1011:

That's very much beside the point. I suggest you let a non-involved editor look at Tony's continuing incivility and childish behavior. It is unfortunate that you first ask for outside opinion (on PManderson, whom you are in conflict with yourself) and then attack the person giving that opinion when

756:

I agree with Dali-Llama's assertions here, Ludovicapipa - he has consistently pointed out that your opinions and statements are valid, and that to the extent that you're participating in a content dispute, your content arguments are worth considering. Whether or not your opinions are correct or go

339:

Certainly, I would agree that we can consider this alert to be done (though not resolved). This is one of the easier-to-deal-with conflicts I've been involved in - I think when someone so clearly refuses to follow the rules, it makes things simpler, albeit with a less satisfying resolution. I don't

119:

All these other nonsense accusations are clearly because Cheeser needs to have the last word. I have no time for his/her stupid games. I cleaned up the article already, removed all questionable material, and moved on. Cheeser just wants to one up me because I "offended" him/her and this is how they

3644:

sometimes, he is backed up in the matter by other editors (myself included, by way of disclaimer), with actually logically-defensible rationales for why to prefer one over the other, which fans of "Moses' " have yet to counter. I do agree with Tony can get a little hot around the collar, but that

3551:

as well, pointing him to several civility policies and advising him that there are better, more civil ways to discuss a policy dispute than the way he's currently doing it. I looked through all four of Radiant's diffs and read through the conversations, and for the most part I believe Radiant has

2367:

And here is where the root of your issue lies: it is your arguments that are mostly unsupported by actual evidence, and, indeed, your edits that contradict other Knowledge content. Your refusal to accept this, along with your personal attacks, revert wars, talk page trolling, and the like, is why

378:

in a futile attempt at getting the upper hand in our disagreements. It was stupid of me to flip out and take my aggressions out on him and I hope he reconsiders filing a compliant to the higher echelon. It was a dumb argument and not worth how far it's gone. Hopefully now this is resolved but it's

147:

I consider the matter over since the original problem - the copyrighted material on the article - has been dealt with - (of course if anyone wants to verify that by all means go ahead.) The rest of what is going on is just utter lameness on Cheeser's part because he/she expects an apology that I'm

115:

the article they would have seen that the material was sourced at the top part of the article in the header. Yes, I admit it was not the usual location at the bottom of the page where they would normally be, but this article was hit once before for violating copyright and I wanted to make it clear

84:

with a copyvio tag because its content was blatanly ripped from a book (and despite plagiarism, the book wasn't even listed as a source). This user responded very rudely, including use of profane language, and assumed that my intetions were bad - that I was trying to get the article deleted out of

3901:

issues and editing "their" article is a good way to get your head bitten off. Epbr123's responses there were reasonable; perhaps you're being overly sensitive to other editors pointing out issues on the article you nominated. I assume you've notified Epbr123 of this alert? If not I shall do so

2363:

I think you'll find that there are more than enough citations in the relevant articles themselves to support what's inserted, either at the same article or elsewhere - and you should be aware that I didn't create all that content myself (I'm never sure why you continue to convince yourself of the

1468:

you are not the rule; instead, you continue to be engaged by established editors with the patience and good faith that is mandated by our core policies. (Nobody, for example has called you a "demon".) Incidentally, wikilink to 'objective' aside, your complaint about the subjectivity of policy has

1053:

a personal attack. Now Radiant, please calm down. I've clearly upset you greatly by analysing your text at the Gender-neutral discussion; I can't resile from that—it was necessary. I'll be pleased when tempers go down five notches, because we need cool heads to negotiate the issues at hand at MOS

165:

Nowhere did I ask for an apology. The purpose of posting this alert is to (I'm quoting myself here) "hopefully help understand how/why to act appropriately on Knowledge." Please do not continue to assume that I was out to get the article deleted (or "annihilated"). It's not up to me to decide if

4270:

I completely agree. He has made a dozen bad-faith AfDs this week, and among other things, has personally attacked several users (including the frivolous complaint here at the WQA against an admin), and has sniped at almost every "keep" vote in these AfDs. He claims that he is being "abused" when

3007:

to make “editing and discussion on this article constructive again,” that strikes me as disingenuous posturing in an attempt to appear as a wise source of reason who seeks only to avoid conflict. The same applies to her claim that I am displaying “signs of ownership”; I believe the true facts to

2759:

2) What do we do when a discussion simply goes on and on without any resolution? Is it just time for mediation? I'm worried that the extremely wearying nature of this discussion is driving people to leave, or at least seriously reduce their involvement - causing those editors who stay to jump in

2710:

has seen much heat and little light over the past several weeks. A {{POV-check}} tag was added, belatedly, on 3 August, and I soon changed it to {{TotallyDisputed}}, which I thought was a more accurate characterization of the debate. (POV-check is generally for minor issues, such as when a new

2450:

G2B is equal if not worse than tharkie, with his edit warring and downright bizarre views and changes to articles that would be misleading to readers. What tends to happen is G2B goes to an article and changes it according to his particular beliefs and obsessions. Then Tharkie comes across the

2304:

Honestly, if the blocks and such haven't yet served as notice to him that his behavior is unacceptable, I'm not sure what additional good a WQA will do (i.e. a user who's already been blocked for disruptive editing isn't likely to respond positively to the kind of gentle reminders WQA volunteers

1369:

Personal attacks are not incivil? Dab really does not need a wikilawyer. Incivility is something you create by misrepresneting statements made by myself and other users. Those who you are in agreement, such ads dab are not incivil. Those who you ideologically are opposed to are reoutinely dubbed

730:

I think my point here is that it's not the content dispute which is at issue--these are all perfectly valid points which we're trying to discuss. My point is that the manner in which you've conducted yourself in this discussion, added with the fact that you've ignored third parties' opinions and

106:

Cheeser is blowing this way out of proportion. He/She is only doing this because he/she thinks I should kiss their ass, that I owe him/her respect because they're "enforcing the rules", and they apparently don't believe that if you accuse someone of something, like plagarism you'd get a negative

3689:

by Pmanderson, while Tony has attempted to improve the MOS to common professional standards in use elsewhere. I have limited computer access for the remainder of this week and next, but I have left one small example of how difficult it has been to work on MOS because of Pmanderson's editing on

2732:

Anyway, I reverted the tag with the summary "re-add tags; the fact that some editors have been worn down or driven off by excessively circular talk page discussion does not mean that issues are "resolved"!", Jaakobou re-reverterd the tag with the summary "rv, i don't follow your commentary/edit

845:

Iam sorry if looks like a personal attack. Iam ONLY worry abt editions --not abt attacks, not at all. Iam sorry if sounds stupid, really. I must reafirm that I am facing an enormous wrok everytime I try to edit an article, whihc she/he deletes, reverts, without ask nor discuss. My goal is edit,

4796:

According to WP Talk Page policies, Epbr is allowed to remove the notice from his Talk page, and putting it back on there could then be considered vandalism or harassment of a sort. You can safely assume that he is aware of the RFC/U now that he has deleted the notice, so if he chooses not to

2903:

and proposed action based on this false premise. In blunt terms, but ones that fall far short of a ‘prohibited’ “personal attack,” I told her what I thought of that stunt. It is a dispute over this issue that underlies her claim that I am “not interested in what other users on the page have to

2644:

But what he and I agree on is of minor consequence here; the main issue is that the UK first/all equal subject already has been debated by a wider group of participants; the majority of people saw, in each case, that there were no grounds on which to give the UK primacy beyond certain specific

3046:

about not being interested in what she and the others had to say before she withdrew the form; quite the opposite, for I posted my best case and waited for others to weigh in. My ‘don’t care’ reaction was only after she falsely claimed a consensus and solicited JimWae to start deleting recent

1957:

Sorry, one more addition. Even after the third opinion today, he twice reverted my edits. We're getting kind of close to 3RR, but I still think that the suggestion given in the third opinion should be made. Should I go back to third opinion, or take it to RfC? Seems like a big step for such a

980:

It's not necessary to start a second thread. Radiant! as others already stated above, I urge you to cool off and remove yourself from this situation. You've now threatened to use your admin tools to block me because I provided you with the diffs showing the past issues. I've summarized the

353:

What's there to resolve? You seem to be assuming that just because I'm a problem for you Cheeser that I'm some sort of threat to this whole website and that I supposedly treat everyone I encounter with the same disrespect I've given you. You're wrong. I simply don't like you because you're an

3241:

Basically, Greg, I think you need to learn to let go a bit and allow the wiki process to take its course. Correct any obvious scientific errors that are introduced, but please acknowledge that others have valuable contributions they can make—if not to the scientific information, then to the

328:

seems quite happy not to. You can take it to higher levels if you want, and you could probably eventually get action, but I think it might be easier to just accept that some people are jerks, and that sometimes the onus is (unfairly) on non-jerks to put up with them. I'm marking as stuck.

652:

Absolutely. I've come to the conclusion that there is nothing more I can do in this case. The entire conversation on my Talk page is available to use as evidence that we tried to resolve this issue and could not, and I will happily endorse a MedCab or ArbCom request if the need arises. —

3726:

Thanks for the update. It does look like a strong case of frayed nerves. A dispute between Tony1 and Radiant can be quickly resolved with a couple apologies in both directions if that's all it is, and then work can resume on the content issues at hand. My advice to both parties stands,

2715:

argued on 6 Aug that we "did not open a talk page subsection explaining this dispute", and that "i see no reason for the orange tag except that one side is unhappy that they look bad with the material in the article". Myself and other editors discussed this and the tags seemed to stick.

550:) for personal attacks. She opened her user account on the EN wikipedia a few hours after being blocked on the PT wikipedia on June 6, 2007. She consistently edits the same articles as the blocked PT username did, including adding the same sources and generally of the same POV (examples 2633:

It seems to me that this issue of Thark's behavious goes well beyond his interactions with me; as I keep saying, his talk page and block log show well enough the wide range of his offences, and where they take place. My opening this discussion here wasn't the start of some personal

1374:. I am exposed to incivlity on a daily basis, an insight into my userpage history would establish this. The "core principle" is being misrepresented for ideological gain by users such as Hornplease, who have much to gain with the loss of constructive editors from the India pages. 1315:

Nobody has ever called Bakasuprman a name that remains an editor in good standing. People are routinely polite to him and requestful of civility, which he fails to return. Unless you can substantiate your justification of his abysmal behaviour with diffs, I suggest you withdraw

3467:) is posting silly personal attacks about me and other people he disagrees with, and disrupting discussion with ad hominems, as well as by alluding to conspiracies and "ploys" against him, and calling people Nazis. Could someone have a word with him and get him to calm down? 573:), and given her history of being blocked from the Portuguese WP, it may also be a case of open harassment at this point. If you feel it'll help, we can try to mediate with her. Otherwise, I'd probably recommend a higher form of dispute resolution and/or a report to the 1519:

Bakasuprman has announced on several occasions that "civility does not apply" in contentious areas of Knowledge. (Contentious areas are anywhere he edits.) My last words on the subject - when he repeated this "defense" yesterday, which Sarvagna seems to share - are here:

1763:

Thank you for the recommendation--but my understanding is that dispute resolution is for article content. This is an interpersonal issue that has almost nothing to do with any Knowledge article. Do you still think mediation would be an appropriate way to deal with this?

2419:

Yes, I caused shit early on in my time here; mostly out of ignorance of the processes of Knowledge combined with bouts of tempermentality. I never claimed to be perfect. But, let's let the records speak for whom is more disruptive than whom - yourself included, Loner.

731:

recommendations and have previously been blocked for the same offense on another project, should raise serious issues about whether or not you fully understand Knowledge and abide by the rules on civility and behavior. This was echoed to me on my PT Knowledge talkpage (

1664:

My comment is in regards to the person bringing the charge of incivility on another editor of WP. And specifically, the person bringing the charge frequently violates WP policy and thus does not have a lot of credibility in bringing up charges against another user.

711:

6. Now the lates blatantly happened on Plano Collor --you said Plan Collor is one thing and PND (Plano Nacional de Desetatização) is another thing --well the link I provided (since you neve provide sources) says PND is a part, one major step to move forward with Plan

2194:

TharkunColl's main modus of operandi is seemingly tactless and irrational reverting; in the edit summary he either offers no explanation at all, claims to be removing POV, or claims to be reverting vandalism, of which only the second reason could possibly be seen as

2891:

To the committee: I’m sorry you’ve been dragged into what I feel is a dispute over childish behavior. While I am quite interested in the consensus of reasonable people, by Enuja’s own admission no consensus had been reached on an issue of great interest to her (see

3140:." I don't see that she performed any kind of "wholesale deletion," especially since information is very rarely permanently deleted on Knowledge (and such requires the intervention of oversight and/or developers to effect.) Rather, I see she was trying to follow 1172: 2719:

Over the past 3 or 4 weeks the dispute has certainly not quited down; if anything, it's become more heated. Those who follow this board (and AN/I and even CSN) have probably cseen some fallout from it. Anyway, the point I'm making is that we seem to be getting

2763:

Thanks, and I apologize for the length of the post, and for the summary which will necessarily exclude all kinds of details - this has been going on for 6 weeks at least, with at least 6 or 7 editors posting extensively, so I'm sure I've missed many things.

2198:

Following on the above, when prompted to participate in discussion about that which he alleges is POV, TharkunColl simply dismisses presented evidence that contradicts his claims, and puts forward little to none in support of his view, thus making his edits

4038:

No one else can make you wear a shoe if it doesn't fit; I don't see how Epbr123 can be responsible for you feeling like a pupil when issues that need to be corrected are pointed out. No reviewer is obligated to repair an article you bring to FAC, and the

704:

4. The only full text you wrote so far concerns Collor´s "Corruption and downfall", trying to damage his image, you only talked abt corruption adn missed several issues --including his Senate ecletion. If it was not me, Collor would still be a convicted

4786:. I wish to restore it, however I did not read anything in RFC guidelines regarding the removal of notification messages one way or the other, so have held off for now. Regardless, the user knows about the RfC, so I guess it has served its purpose. -- 2711:

article is created by someone who doesn't feel they can be entirely neutral, and voluntarily asks for a "sanity check" by a second editor.) Anyway, the tag was reverted and unreverted a bunch of times over the next few days, without explanation, until

989:

asking uninvolved admins to step in. I suggest your personal involvement in this (including threats to use your admin tools) has escalated the conflict and taken this issue beyond the level of informal dispute mediation that can occur on this page.

3047:

additions to the article. Her above allegation to you seriously mischaracterizes the true facts and seems nothing more than another attempt to garner support for her cause. I have been a contributor to Knowledge for years and can assure you that all

3684:

I'm sorry to see a conflict erupt between Tony1 and Radiant, two good editors. IMO the problem actually originated with Pmanderson, and Radiant found himself in the middle of Tony1's exhausted patience after long-standing disruption to Knowledge's

3896:

Please try to avoid mischaracterizing someone else's comments as "educate the rest of Knowledge". No FAC reviewer is obligated to make the changes to the article; some may choose to do so, but it's not generally wise, as some FAC nominators have

3763:

At any rate, I hope the analysis I left for Radiant of the issues that are occurring at MOS, and how difficult that editing environment has been, will still be useful. Perhaps it would be appropriate for Radiant to withdraw from this conflict?

687:

Why dont´also say that none of yr editions damaging Collor´s image and linking him to "Corruption and Downfall" (this one considered POV); why dont´you say you linked an image from "Veja Magazine" on which is said: "The year we got rid of him"

3268:

Darkwind: Thank you for taking the time to respond to this issue. Volunteers such as youself serve a very valuable service since unresolvable disputes can really ruin the Knowledge experience. A third party can be just what it takes to break

195:

Also, please note that concerns about your incivility and assumption of bad faith are not tied to the copyright violations. Removing the copyrighted material does not change the fact that your conduct was, and continues to be, inappropriate.

3781:

I don't see why Radiant should withdraw; Tony attacked him for daring to disagree on GNL. Nor am I saying this out of gratitude for an unsuccessful RfA nomination nine months ago; Sandy is far more closely tied to Tony than I am to Radiant.

2008:) have told him that this action is irrelevant. If this continues, I'm considering starting an RfC. Does anyone have any other suggestions? It seems silly/excessive to apply for an RfC, but it seems there may be no other choice. — 408:

sort of RFC/U or anything like that. I'm happy this worked itself out, and would like to thank Cyberia for being good enough to work towards a resolution - I can imagine how hard it is to make this apology, and I appreciate it. --

107:

reaction about it. But since the Ettiquite rules state that Wikipedians are to be emotionless and mindless robots and not allowed to voice an opinion ever, and I voiced one and made an argument and he/she is pissed off about it.

4813:

Right, I just remembered that, and another user let me know of the same as well. ;-) As it has been already said, he knows about the RfC and his refusal to participate only makes things more likely to go against him, sadly. --

2843:. There was a fair amount of constructive, collaborative editing sparked by Greg L's contributions, but one exception was the response of other editors to the huge expansion of the "mass versus weight" section. I initiated a 1130: 700:

3. On Fernando Collor talk page you asked me to ask and discuss before revert or delete --that´s not wht you did on thsi same artcile --within few minutes you deleted and reverted without discussiong and even requested a page

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him, many, many times; unfortunately, to no avail. Thark continues with his anti-British paranoia, and to throw jabs at people even when they're generally being respectful in return; and those are just a couple of the things

620:

Sorry for the delay on responding to this - I've been busy with off-wiki stuff and have also been trying to field a barrage of edits to my own Talk page regarding this issue. It appears that Ludovicapipa does not understand

3582:

I do thank you for bringing this issue here, though. For the most part, I think you're doing a good job in the dispute. Just a few rough edges to polish off, that's all. We're certainly willing to help mediate, though. —

2977:

that had been in the article for years. He deleted it only nine hours after I had edited the table (I had restored it to full size after someone truncated it). This was very suspicious timing given that his previous edit to

116:

where the info was coming from. If it was in the wrong spot I apoligize for thinking that for once some people didn't have to be led by the hand around here. Anyway, if you look at the history it was referenced at the top.

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There's no RFC yet... Given that there is growing consensus that one is necessary now, it's in the process of being established. Unless anyone else beats me to it, I plan on working on it sometime tomorrow afternoon. --

642:

If you do recuse yourself, I understand (you won't be the first nor the second). I will probably end up sending this to arbitration anyways, so I hope I can count on your support for my request for that if you do recuse

2737:

restored it saying "This is a hugely disputed article..Lead stuffed with inappropriate "context", written to the "minority view" eg over whether it was a massacre, lots evidence missing." I have given in and written an

1587:

attacks themselves, then deal with that through appropriate channels, not by attacking in return. Otherwise, if the bigotry is not affecting articles and not leading to attacks, then I am afraid the official Knowledge

489:, but what has concerned me is her attitude in this debate. She has accused me of acting in bad faith, and issued numerous personal attacks. She has also petitioned administrators directly to block me, outside of the 691:

1. Why don´t you say you deleted the words "end of hyperinflation" and substituted for "hyperinflation" only? Collor Plan was not a failure --so many citations prove the following administrations still use his Plan

1551:

This is great Hornplease. All Bakasuprman stated was "willfully making false statements" and there is a long line of commentary by you and Akhilleus. When we take a look at a larger diff around the same discussion

582:

Good job on staying civil, especially in the situation where Ludovicapipa questioned your age. It's remarkably difficult to stay calm when someone's deliberately trying to get you to respond to personal attacks. —

4702:

I've notified the administrator (yes, Picaroon is an administrator, much to my surprise) to justify his actions. I've also reverted his changes on the AFDs I've found so far, with additional comments as needed. --

1463:

I am not aware of a single "wiki rule" I have broken to "attempt" to ban you. I am not even sure whether a reply is warranted here, as it should be obvious by now from this discussion alone that ad hominem attacks

568:

Thanks for bringing this to our attention. I'm not sure if there's really much we'll be able to do in this situation - it's quite clear that Ludovicapipa is acting uncivilly toward you (including a violation of

4305:

Yes, indeed it did. However, as I tried to diffuse the situation myself near the climax/end of it all, I'll get the attention of the users who could probably best help you (and other outside observers) out. --

2407:, going back to his inaugural attempt to put "Canada is a kingdom" into the opening of the article on Canada. While I don't condone some aspects of Thark's behaviour, G. is much the more disruptive of the two. 1941:). Beyond that, I guess it's just the stubbornness against change. I spent a bunch of time putting everything into a wikitable, and his comment was "Maybe next time you could contribute some actual content." — 4178:

not on the WQA. Your behavior is inappropriate and you should seriously reconsider how you are approaching this issue (and for the record, I am a 22-year-old graduate student pursuing a Ph.D. in mathematics).

270:

in this (or virtually any) circumstance cannot possibly hinder you from doing so. I'm not going to "explode," but I will continue to point you to the policies that explain why you are mistaken in this matter.

4626:

Probably not a bad idea, given that he just put another few dozen articles up for Deletion. (I haven't read through them all, so I can't comment on whether it was appropriate or not, but at the very least,

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he is appointed by Knowledge to delete bad articles - he thinks he speaks for the entire Knowledge community (despite the fact that many of his currently-running AfDs have snowballed-keep). He seems to be

4344: 4233: 1270:) is probably editing right now while Akhilleus, entrusted with the admin tools to serve the 'pedia is using a questions semantics to facilitate a witchhunt against users in good standing. Defecation, yes. 97:, and the user believes that it's fine to act like this. I was wondering if a third party could comment on this and hopefully help this user understand how/why to act appropriately on Knowledge. Thanks. -- 110:

I must say that in regard to his first accusation of the article not being properly sourced, Cheeser must have been too busy adding the copyright violation tag, because had they actually took the time to

134:'s talk page, encouraging him to be more civil, but he seems to have pre-emptively rejected any such suggestion. If this is the case, I'm afraid that there's very little that a Wikiquette alert can do. 4572:

of abusing administrator power by warning him about his AfDs. I looked and was immediately surprised to see him going on what can only be described as a deletion spree. I can't speculate as to why, but

3601:

While Tony does tend to be unusually aggressive, and believes that the MOS should be used to promote "modern" views on English, he also tend to cool down and consider arguments after a few days. I find

4118:

No need; I have a degree in statistics. It doesn't matter if my "win" rate is lower than average (although I think it's way above average), my supported AfDs still vastly outweigh my rejected ones.

2074: 1655:

This is about incivility. Your remarks about POV-pushing are not striclt relevant, like BAkasuprman's similar ones above. (Incidentally, if anyone's interested, those articles need massive cleanup.)

3796:

Nor are you the only one who noticed this rather out-of-place accusation. I just didn't comment on it when I noticed it yesterday because I didn't want to reopen the discussion in this section. --

2229:

rejects community input; resists moderation and/or requests for comment, continuing to edit in pursuit of a certain point despite an opposing consensus from impartial editors and/or administrators.

3823:, I've marked it as Stuck here. I don't see that there's anything more we can do in this situation - the situation is apparently much more complex than we're equipped to deal with here on WQA. — 2768: 2756:

consent. I realize this may not be practically required in all cases, but I'd never dream of removing a tag when two or three editrs disagree, without having some overwhelming exceptional reason.

2700: 1739:

are interested in resolving the dispute. We cannot really help when one or more parties are still jabbing at each other throughout the process. I would recommend you move on to a higher form of

4327: 4077: 2005: 1997: 1895: 178:(which you refuse to acknowledge as applicable). It states prominently that if you do not want content to be mercilessly edited (possibly deleted), do not contribute it. And finally, if you read 577:. The fact that there is a block history for this user on another version of WP makes it less likely that you'll need to go through a lot of dispute resolution procedures before getting action. 2517:

attention." i.e. No-one else objects to Tharkie's stance on this issue enough to upbrade him about it, and G2B has to go telling tales and canvassing in order to try and get someone to do so.

1915:

The only thing I've read is the conversation on your talk page, in which he's perhaps slightly sarcastic, but not totally out of bounds. I suspect that the larger issue isn't any violation of

4724:, where I pointed out why I thought his actions were inappropriate and what a more appropriate solution would be (he replied, dismissing my objections, not surprisingly). I was unaware that 2797:

We might both be right if what the central foci of difference are (the polemics surrounding the use of the term 'massacre') are, in a sense, tangential to the real subject of the article.

4334:

is not really an option here; he is clearly attempting to be disruptive for whatever reason. In my opinion, this has escalated far past a mere etiquette violation and constitutes abuse.

3963:

If reviewers fix articles themselves, the main authors don't learn anything. If you guys fix these things yourself, you'll be more likely to remember to do them with your future articles.

2244:

on a low level that might not exhaust the general community's patience, but that operates toward an end of exhausting the patience of productive rules-abiding editors on certain articles.

1304:. And like you concede yourself, you supported an indef on him on the most bogus grounds(as the arbcom pointed out). So stop trying to appropriate the moral high ground for yourself. 4540: 4536: 4528: 4520: 4516: 4513: 4510: 4506: 4502: 4494: 4480: 4476: 4459: 4455: 4451: 4447: 4443: 4430: 4426: 4413: 4409: 4405: 4401: 2379:, put together with your block log and comments on your talk page, you seem to be a disruptive editor. That's not to say you can't change, but as it stands, things don't look good. -- 81: 2568:

it's up to you to back up your claim in the first place. Thark would not be petty and buerocratic enough to go round pages like this trying to get people in trouble that's for sure.

1129:), which found no grounds for blocking Bakasuprman, and he remains an editor in good standing. Another reason for Bakasuprman to be upset with me is a discussion I initiated on ANI ( 333: 4003:- I find this a little bit condescending to be honest. I'm not complaining, but I just thought I'd point out the irony of a system where people are told off for telling people off. 1638:

I find it interesting that Hornplease brings up uncivility and violation of WP codes of conduct when he takes part in much the same. Hornplease has routinely pushed his pov on the

2460:

It's frustrating: here we have 'two' editors G2B & Tharky (both who obviously care about the accurarcy of 'Commonwealth' related articles) ripping each other apart. They have

982: 846:

he/she call it POV. I don´t, since I FULLY provide citations, sources, as you could see above. Since I started talikgn to him/her I did the same, but seems to be a waste of time.

493:

mechanism. I would just ignore normally, but considering this expanding to other peoples' talk pages I figure a check from third parties would be good. Here are a few examples:

2493:

Yes, he and I obviously face off often. However, he's been riling people up at other pages and has been blocked for his actions there as well as where he and I cross paths. --

2847:

on the issue, but Greg L has stated the he is not interested in what other users on the page have to say, and he has been attacking other user's suitability to edit the page.

4600:, except that I'm not sure what the point of the behavior would be. (I'd like to AGF, but it's a bit of a stretch). Is there an RfC up somewhere, or has this gone to AN/I? -- 2788:

Hmm, another reason we need some help. You're saying that we're focusing on too many different things, Jaakobou is saying that the disputes are only really narrow and minor.

2364:

opposite). You have been directed to said articles time and time again; that you refuse to either look at or accept the cited content therein is nobody's issue but your own.

383: 124: 1415:

or users subsequently banned is no excuse for incivility to users in good standing, none of whom are rude to Bakasuprman. Note, finally, his dismissal ofthis entire process

120:

get revenge. I'll be the first to admit that I can be a sarcastic bastard because I really don't take much in life seriously. I guess Cheeser wants a consensus to prove it.

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If you had a degree in statistics, you'd realize that what you just said is nonsense. I'm really good at getting wet when I swim. I get we 100% of the time I swim. Is that

3640:(a guideline cannot actually "mandate" anything) consistent possessive indicator usage, instead of mutually contraditory and incompatible rationales for dropping the final 3874: 3051:

edits by others are treated in the proper Knowledge manner and any good-faith disagreements with other editors that are discussed on talk pages are debated professionally.

599:

Well, this is by far the toughest dispute I've ever faced--aggravated by the fact that other users have refused to become involved and even third-opinion good samaritans (

3944:

No, Akhilleus. The fact that there were so many MOS problems with the article after it had been promoted shows that formatting was not heavily focused on during the FAC.

4770:

No problem. Thank you for all the work that you've done. I've officially launched the RfC against Epbr and will be notifying users involved with the dispute shortly. --

2606:, or other articles would have other things to say. If he won't be reasoned with, what other options present themselves to bring a resolution to the ongoing problems? -- 1874: 1261: 1578:

something to worry about. It can be hard to remain civil in a highly charged atmosphere; but there is no excuse whatsoever for dismissing this as a minor consideration.

4501:

about the subjectivity of the criteria - a point he could have made on the article's talk page, something to be discussed and resolved with other editors. Instead, he

1975:

consensus in favour of "Discontinued flavors", he will honour it. I'd give him a chance to respond and, if he continues to insist on "Flavor graveyard", start an RFC.

324:- I think we've taken it as far as this Wikiquette alert can go. Wikiquette alerts are really only useful when dealing with users who *want* to adhere to policy, and 4751:. For those of us directly involved with this, please feel free to modify my work, since it's been a long while since I've ever had to file an RfC against anyone. -- 1982: 1969: 1952: 1927: 4797:

respond to the RFC, you should add a link to the diff of your original notice to the RFC so that other users are specifically aware of his refusal to participate. —

3750:

Please see the new section "Block" on my talk page (unfortunate coincidence in a whole-ISP block I've been caught up in). I hope this is the end of the matter here.

459: 4818: 4808: 4678:. He seems to be supporting these absurd claims of "trolling" (probably because that's one less keep vote) however, even if a poorly justified vote on an AfD isn't 4289:

Are there any specific diff's you'd like an unbiased observer to look at? The whole big-bust thing went on for a little too long for me to entirely follow. Best, --

3183:

That being said, I also think you were a bit quick to call a "vote" on the Mass vs. Weight section (on 12 August). Discussion is indeed the correct first step, as

1296:

Bakasuprman routinely gets called names and abused all the time by one side (your side?) of a particular divide (see his userpage). And I havent seen you use your

4271:

people point out his bad-faith nominations, and seems to believe that accusations of bad faith are themselves bad faith (when in fact, WP:AGF only goes so far). --

2925:

I also created the CG illustration for it. Both articles had degraded to the point that they were difficult to read and had significant factual errors. Please see

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has been considered, however I wished to start this informal RfC first, and, perhaps, have others directly communicate with TharkunColl regarding his behaviour. --

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As long as Tharky keeps his arguments to the 'talk pages', doesn't get overly combative on the 'edit summaries' & restrains from Edit warring - I'm at peace.

516:", roughly translating to "that shows the level of person we have have here" (Google translate is similar), questioning what I'm assuming is my educational level. 344: 4774: 4765: 4707: 4388: 4284: 4275: 3878: 2962:

article have been entirely the opposite. A small group of the people—those cited above by Enuja—have seemingly not ‘warmed’ to a newcomer. One of them seemingly

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Thanks for referencing all those great policies and showing me the wickedness of my ways. But, in this case, regarding my attitude toward you, it's time to cite

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pointed out. Someone has an idea, you respond, they rebut, you rebut, and by then or there abouts, if neither of you changes your mind, THEN perhaps ask for a

2949:

article behaved very maturely, welcomed the improvements, and sought to assist (one of them even solicited my efforts to merge a now-redundant article into it).

2663: 2627: 1732: 1650: 1633: 1546: 1330: 1195: 1089: 878: 4055: 3914: 3791: 4539:). He also seems to like to accuse people of the violations that they are accusing him of (when accused of bad faith, he accuses bad faith, and the same with 3995: 3939: 3929: 3660: 2455: 1704: 1473: 1458: 1387: 1364: 1354: 1283: 743: 4733: 4651: 4338: 3974: 2497: 2437: 2424: 2350: 1831: 1801: 1773: 1754: 1409: 1242: 1228: 1036: 1002: 888: 827: 664: 647: 637: 615: 594: 400: 4207: 4084: 3948: 3674: 3594: 2572: 2521: 1511: 1423: 1338: 1320: 1251: 1117:, and I find some of his contributions to our discussions a bit uncivil. Bakasuprman is upset with me, primarily because I endorsed his indefinite block on 4216: 4023: 4007: 3805: 3631: 2610: 2546: 2396: 1308: 4160: 4122: 4113: 3776: 2801: 2792: 2779: 2652: 2476: 2383: 2332: 2318: 1678: 1669: 1659: 1558: 863:

on the article. That will attract the attention of more editors who can offer opinions on both sides of the dispute. The important thing, though, is to

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In my observation you've never ceased to do so, but merely gotten craftier about it. However, let the full records say what they may to anyone else. --

1178:

What I'm looking for here is primarily some outside perspective: is this kind of discourse the kind of thing I should expect on India-related pages, as

4012:

I apologize if my analysis seems condescending - I assure you it wasn't meant to be. As I said, I didn't see any particular lack of civility there. —

3425: 3402: 3366: 3316: 3251: 2883: 1859: 735:) by another user, who clearly stated that the reason you were blocked there was not because of content disputes, but because of your personal conduct 418: 1058: 2400: 2019: 1909: 3071: 2042: 4484: 4043:

instructions encourage nominators to respond well to criticism. Epbr123's comments are not in the least uncivil; this alert looks unnecessary.

4379:, but instead of grouping them, he nominated them all at once (this is why the admin warned him). He justified it using an (invalid) citation of 4351: 2934: 1095: 2464:

in common then they both care to admit- 'strong willed', 'intelligent', 'demanding accurary', in otherwords 'well meaning editors'. If only the

708:

5. What abt "1964 Brazilian coup" artcile wto which you only used one source (Gaspari´s, a famous antiprivatization, antiCollor, procommunist?);

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Most of what you’ve said above seems like good, common-sense dispute resolution advise. I take issue with one observation you made: A lack of “

1898:. This whole thing seems to stem from his not understanding how Wiki ownership works, and it's starting to bug me. Where can I go from here? — 1674:

I think Akhilleus has a lot of credibility. If you cannot point to these 'frequent violations' of WP policy, perhaps you should withdraw that.

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in a deletionist sort of way. His behavior has me concerned, particularly his sniping of people on the linked AFD and I feel that it requires

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for example. He constantly marks people's comments as "ILIKEIT" and makes other unfounded remarks in order to antagonize and discredit them.

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Thanks for the heads up. I've contributed a bit, and while I don't think I have more to contribute, I might come up with something later. --

4755: 4669:, and Epbr is helping that user out by telling him/her that his removals (which I would consider serious vandalism) are being reverted. See 4264: 3868: 3136:

do indeed have the ring of "I worked hard on this, don't touch my stuff." From there, your responses also start to lose the appearance of "

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In cases like that, if you feel that an editor is unfairly reverting your changes and refusing to discuss the situation, please look into a

1325:

The amount of self-delusion required to make such a statement like that is amazing. Dbachmann seems to still be here, even after utilizing

1215:

blocked since september 2006, and the recent defecations on my block log are in no small part to akhilleus personal crusade against myself.

1126: 1079: 611:, but I don't know if we should try to reason once more (and if so, how should we reason?), or go straight to an administrative position.-- 3603: 3529:

arguments, but I don't have time to go over the whole situation at the moment. I'll come back later on today and give it another look. --

340:

think it needs to go up the ladder, unless this situation becomes more of a problem, for myself or other users. Thanks for your input. --

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That said, it seems you, Gazzster, and GoodDay should know that I'm not unaware of what Thark and I agree and disagree on; I thought

1419:. Unless he is told sternly that random incivility and motive-questioning poisons the atmosphere here, he will continue in his ways. 1136:

While it's understandable that he dislikes me, I find some of Bakasuprman's comments towards me vexing, and possibly in violation of

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The fact that the vast majority of AfD I make end with a deletion show that the Knowledge community backs my "destructive" actions.

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1) Under what circumstances are maintenance tags removed? Whever I've done it, it's been by posting on the talk page and getting

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One should click on the links where you see a personal attack I see a self defense against a constant persecution of my editions:

4544: 4490: 3701:. For someone who has worked as hard as Tony1 has to improve Knowledge, that's just insulting and the whole point behind DTR. 2835:

is a class-B Vital article that Greg L has been doing an enormous amount of work on. Unfortunately, the user's behavior on the

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is currently locked, I have not, as of yet, notified him of this posting. I will do so at the earliest possible opportunity. --

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talk page regarding that rewrite. I also engaged in professional and good-faith debate with other editors during that rewrite (

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I would like more people's input (from an outsider's point of view) regarding this before we proceed with a possible RFC. --

3649:, and while I don't condone the incivility, it is sometimes not difficult to understand how someone can feel driven to it. — 1267: 1068:

I'm closing this WQA for the same reasons as the first one - the entire issue has been escalated to the Admin Noticeboard. —

761:

violations), telling him to "go see a doctor", and otherwise calling him out in the manner you have, you have been violating

3418:

I've changed the tag on top to "resolved" as it seems to be so. Thanks for the help from Darkwind, and thanks to Greg L!

3088:, and what I see there is slightly disturbing in the sense that you all started out so well, but then it quickly degraded. 3020: 2844: 2729:

comments to "on" and "off" -topic sections, insisting that he won't comment in a section if he finds the title "NPOV", etc)

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on the editor with whom you're arguing - if you do that, people will be much less likely to take your opinions seriously. —

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after having receiving insufficient interest from others in her “issue” and obtained mixed results from those who commented

1533:

If holders of virulent bigotry continue to be praised when editing, some mildly charged rhetoric is nothing to worry about.

3468: 2226:; fails to cite sources, cites unencyclopaedic sources, misrepresents reliable sources, or manufactures original research. 1939: 1936: 1933: 1873: 1790:. And the mediation processes are there mainly to help resolve issues between editors, so hopefully they can help you. — 1085:

I agree with Kieferskunk, though the diff posted to start this thread doesn't rise to the level that it's made out to. --

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is a behavioural guideline. It is not set in stone; there can be exceptions and common sense applies. But the idea is a

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I have, however, taken seriously people's observations here regarding me. I certainly hope Thark has done the same. --

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Thank you for doing that, Cyberia. It shows a good-faith effort on your part to restore civility to the discussion. —

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is in charge of clean up, and that when edit wars ensue, he is in charge of fixing it by AfD'ing the whole thing (see

4212:

I'm sorry, Cheeser1. I misread the part of your userpage which mentioned graduate school. You are stalking me though.

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not, and they'd never even see it. The "This is a minor edit" button is not supposed to be abused in this fashion. --

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If this is not the point of view of the country schoolmaster setting tasks to his pupils, it really needs recasting.

2599: 2183: 2080: 57: 4783: 1183: 1179: 1157: 1149: 4323: 2926: 500: 2241: 1152:, accusing me of religious bias and being a "maladroit hack", following my restoration of a talk page comment at 47: 17: 3694: 1501: 3646: 1416: 766:

the content, and often become "He said/She said" personal attack arguments, which are not welcome on Knowledge.

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etc. And PS, I'm kinda pleased you cite above, coz I don't think people will see it as aggressive at all.

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I don't have time to add too much exposition to these points right. Well, we'll see how much I crank out.

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on the issue, but Greg L has stated the he is not interested in what other users on the page have to say…”

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I made on his talk page clarified my position on the entire UK first/all equal situation between he and I.

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I've started this process - I want to see it cease so that editing can be more productive. I want to see

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FAC process focuses on formatting and copyediting, rather than addressing the substance of the article.

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seems to have been causing undue disruption across a number of articles for some time now, including at

3348: 3194: 2971: 2138: 1621: 38: 174:, however, is not optional. Feeling like after "spend time on it, get pissed when ..." is covered by 4569: 3691: 3636:

That was an inaccurate summary of the apostrophe-s siuation; not only is Tony arguing for the MoS to

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Well, actually, the vast majority of all AfD's end with a deletion, so that doesn't show much. See

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I also note that someone actually left a template on Tony1's talk page, perhaps never having read

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should take a break from those articles & see how the 'rest' of the Wiki community edits them.

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I agree with Cheeser1's statement here. Epbr123, the comment above is definitely a violation of

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is just another example of the level of discourse we can expect in this area of Knowledge, where

1300:

to try and put an end to it. And on that page you were restoring a comment that was clearly in

1211:

in a manner which allows facilitators of admin abuse to whine about incivility. I have not been

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I would like advice on how to make editing and discussion on this article constructive again.

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So, you actually have no evidence that counters what presently speaks for Thark's behaviour. --

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been remaining calm and civil (though citing Godwin's Law was not a good move, in my opinion).

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the page -- before the AfD he's started on it is even complete. This is beyond silly now.

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This guy seems to be stalking me. He's just a schoolkid, though, so I'll make allowances.

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I've been engaged in a protracted content dispute with Ludovica on a few pages, including

8: 4101: 4001:

even if it could have been stated more politely. It is a little condescending as written

3925: 3204: 3004: 1993: 1891: 1855:] and initiating a similar approach with "Baka", documenting his plethora of offenses. -- 1827: 1769: 1728: 1441:

demonization. This case is nothing short of caprice, considering this "process" has been

1405: 1305: 1238: 1191: 1145: 1141: 2190:, etc. There seems to be two main, though intertwined, issues with his overall actions: 1429:

everyone incivilly" is nothing short of misrepresentation and defamation. The policy on

4238:

Knowledge:Articles for deletion/List of big-bust models and performers (5th nomination)

3801: 3670: 3534: 3476: 3430: 3362: 3247: 2896:). Nevertheless, in bad faith, she suggested that since no consensus had been reached, 2314: 2233: 2204: 2187: 2171: 2155: 1153: 1013: 951: 947:) Unfortunately, despite the thread above, his aggressive behavior continues unabated. 367: 4647:

I agree; an RfC or mention to AN/I is wholly appropriate now, given his track record.

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gratingly condescending, particularly his idea that the FAC regulars are entitled to

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You might be able to have an 'Administrator' notify him (or allow you to notify him).

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more closely, you'll find that you should be civil to anyone, even people who enforce

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continues to ignore the slight consensus that has been reached on this page (see the

1959: 1942: 1899: 1646:]. I don't edit all that much on WP, but do notice improper behavior when I see it. 1086: 991: 900: 847: 719: 505:

If you insist, I will ask and administrator to block you, so you can refresh yr mind.

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against an administrator who warned him that his deletion rampage was disruptive. --

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he is the only one in charge of deciding whether an article can be properly sourced

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Unsubstantiated accusations of "bad faith" or frivolous accusations of "ILIKEIT":

1786:

The dispute resolution process also applies to interpersonal disputes. Check out

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Oops, just discovered a bit of a conflict here, which I wasn't aware of before.

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a basis for disregarding the official policy on civility and no personal attacks.

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article looked like before I started on it 22 days ago. The authors over on the

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If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the

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There are a few others but I have to go back and search through blanked pages.

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In my recent conversations with Epbr123, in addition to his recent remarks on

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Hmm, okay. Since we got the third opinion today, he twice reverted my edits (

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particularly indicative on both tendencies. It happens to be political; but

2203:. This obstinacy can, and has, resulted in ceaseless debate on talk pages, 4725: 4632: 4601: 4290: 4213: 4166: 4119: 4092: 4062:

Gotta agree there with Sandy and Epbr, not that my word is worth much now.

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This is an inflammatory personal attack, which has no place on Knowledge,

4509:. He's made it a point to drag irrelevant topics into the AfD by asking 4253: 3561:

Radiant: Some advice for you as well: Please ensure you're up to date on

3392: 3306: 3123: 3091: 3061: 2871: 2859: 2812: 2000:) and has contacted Ben & Jerry's for their opinion. Two people (one 1371: 486: 1171:, as well as apparently accusing me of anti-Hindu bias (full discussion 1133:) in July 2007 that lead to him being briefly blocked for edit warring. 899:

I didn´t threaten you --I suggested to the adms you should be blocked.

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quite the opposite. I am particularly galled by her above statement of…

2877: 2865: 1856: 1688: 1554:] we Restating something in different words--how is this now uncivil? 1438: 1301: 1055: 934: 910: 600: 4131:

remarkable? No. Everybody gets wet 100% of the time when they swim. --

3665:

We're not "here". This alert was closed on this page two weeks ago. --

2986:

talk page betrayed an underlying annoyance with recent events over on

2733:

summary - what factuality problems are you contesting exactly ?", and

2248:

Hence, TharkunColl's general actions seem to place him squarely under

1822:

is likely to attract univolved editors, but thank you for the advice.

4730: 4648: 4348: 4335: 3340: 3186: 2853: 1938:); previously, he reverted an edit when I removed trademark symbols ( 1684: 1434: 2914: 2832: 2816: 2159: 1442: 884:

make me question whether or not I should bump this up the ladder.--

4782:

Note: I notified the user about the RfC against him; he has since

2001: 1233:

Is "defecations" actually the word you wanted, or is this a typo?

1167:

This is not an isolated occurrence; earlier Bakasuprman called me

4489:

Sorry, I know that's alot of links. If you only click one, click

1164:

is apparently supposed to mean that I am idiotic, not malicious.

3721:

Have to strongly agre with SandyGeoria on eery word of he above.

2746:

paragraph, which I believe is very typical of the entire piece.

1500:

Neutral editors reviewing this post may also like to comment on

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told him to stop disruptively nominating articles for deletion

3821:

Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#Admin Radiant!

3618:" at FA suggests that he does not understand what a guideline 3353:'s behavior outside of the comments that appeared from him on 2683:; Removal of maintenance tags, exhausting circular discussions 1207:. I dont deal with abuse nicely, and will refuse to interpret 3300:

the talk page. He hadn’t edited that article in the previous

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Issue is now resolved. Thanks to everyone for their help. —

526:" Is it really necessary to insult me by questioning my age? 512:

After I make a spelling mistake in Portuguese, she states: "

4365:

accuse an intervening administrator of etiquette violations

3159: 4507:

decided unilaterally that the article wasn't worth keeping

2063: 1049:

So let me get this right: "childish behaviour" is somehow

170:. No one is asking you to "win kudos" or "make friends" - 3505:

Just on the basis of that fourth diff you linked, I left

3034:

She withdrew (deleted) her own Request-for-Comments form

1247:

If so, it's a typo he makes with surprising regularity.

3207:

and the operation of Knowledge and any wiki in general.

695:

2. Also here, let´s see wht´s written abt yr editions:

2921:

article: I completely re-wrote it. And in the case of

2862:

is engaged in editing and discussion on the talk page

1890:

There has been a slight battle over at this page from

1691:

community, so too does Akhilleus among this community.

4322:

argument -- as has all been pointed out -- he is now

3614:

is equally dismaying. (His habit of speaking of "MOS

2724:

from consensus, rather than closer. This being said,

1333:. Of course, dab is not incivil, because he is not a 379:

now his decision how he wants to pursue the matter.

2391:

I essentially concur with Thark's assessment. User

2260:

show some of the extensive evidence of his conduct.

626:

to simply recuse myself from this Alert entirely. —

1335:"Hindu nationalist communalist sockpuppeting troll" 1113:I've been involved in some editing conflicts with 252:not carte blanche for you for do whatever you want 166:we're allowed to plagiarize copyrighted material: 2207:, page locks, and his being blocked from editing. 715:There are many other examples of yr behaviour.... 503:: Ludovica threatens me with a block (somehow): " 4439:Other non-constructive responses to keep votes: 2982:had been a year prior. Further, his post to the 1992:I'm changing this from Resolved to In Progress. 1445:by partisans hoping to broadcast their opinions. 477:. The disputes center around the application of 4596:Hmm... I'd say that's being more than a little 2760:proclaiming that the dispute no longer exists. 4250:taking ownership of the aforementioned article 4149: 497:Constant accusations of "acting in bad faith". 4260:on this user sometime in the near future. -- 3761:Knowledge:Requests for adminship/Pmanderson 2 3547:I left a message on Tony1's talk page and on 3005:claim of seeking advise and guidance from you 1644:] and removed WP:RS sources w/o discussion 542:: It's important to point out that this user 3220:Your response here also indicates a lack of 2868:I am engaged in discussion on the talk page 1127:Knowledge:Requests for arbitration/Hkelkar 2 501:User talk:Dalillama#Fernando Collor de Mello 4234:Talk:List of big-bust models and performers 2375:The record stands: by all four criteria of 2309:if it continues after the block expires. -- 2211:Overall, TharkunColl's moves show that he: 4523:by Xhir. He believes that the AfD page is 3819:Because this issue has now been raised at 2917:article what I had previously done to the 1743:, such as informal or formal mediation. — 1574:is an official policy in Knowledge. It is 1370:"incivil" which has turned into a term of 258:is only provided for if you are trying to 2403:) has a long history as the epitome of a 1205:since I obviously should have been banned 1140:. The latest examples can be found on my 4720:brought up the uncommented deletions on 4667:deleting people's "votes" in Epbr's AfDs 3873:Does anyone else find Epbr123's part in 3242:formatting and layout of the article. -- 3120:insofar as your responses to her and to 520:Talk:Fernando Collor de Mello#Last reply 370:about this incident. I admit I violated 186:or people you believe to be "morons." -- 4497:that his AfD was an attempt to prove a 2913:Please note that I’ve recently done to 2598:know of him, editors who contribute to 2466:All are equal VS UK, first among equals 1642:page and posted citations in bad faith 1169:"uneducated, dishonest, and irrational" 14: 4387:. He has been extraordinarily uncivil 4328:List of big-bust models and performers 4078:List of big-bust models and performers 3166:, then a brief summary can be left in 2970:just to make a bad-faith edit by flat 1723:this "discussion" ought to be closed. 1339:Hornplease has a big axe to grind here 66:- incivility and bad faith assumptions 44:Do not edit the contents of this page. 2305:typically leave). I'd refer this to 532:- User tells me to go "find a doctor" 366:For the record, I left an apology on 4562:accuse an admin of an abuse of power 4531:). It appears that he believes that 2468:schism could be sorted out. Perhaps 1203:Its obvious you are on a witch-hunt 25: 4525:the place to discuss content issues 4248:, and, in an odd sort of way, even 3610:that the MOS should simply mandate 1012:he turns out to disagree with you. 514:Por aí nota-se que nível temos aqui 176:the policy I already pointed you to 23: 4747:I've begun breaking ground on the 4729:the deck is stacked against you?) 3337:I didn't take the time to examine 2180:Elizabeth II of the United Kingdom 260:"to improve or maintain Knowledge" 24: 4832: 4661:I'm also going to point everyone 4472:Other non-constructive comments: 2856:deleted the expansion very early 2749:I'd like opinions on two issues: 2742:summary of the POV problems with 2600:Second city of the United Kingdom 2184:Second city of the United Kingdom 1121:in April 2007; the discussion is 981:conversation (with all diffs) at 4422:Personally insulting responses: 3847: 3438: 2823: 2688: 2051: 1881: 1104: 918: 435: 82:Star Trek planet classifications 71: 29: 4363:, Epbr took it upon himself to 3084:I took some time today to read 2958:However, my experiences on the 2242:Knowledge:Ownership of articles 18:Knowledge:Wikiquette assistance 4819:20:21, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4809:20:06, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4791:19:41, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4775:19:18, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4766:17:54, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4756:17:10, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4734:21:57, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4708:14:50, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4691:11:49, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4652:04:04, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4643:03:52, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4622:03:45, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4612:03:40, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4591:03:10, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4136:05:36, 11 September 2007 (UTC) 4123:21:34, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 4114:20:15, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 3869:19:18, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 3806:23:59, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 3792:20:11, 10 September 2007 (UTC) 3675:04:31, 21 September 2007 (UTC) 3661:04:22, 21 September 2007 (UTC) 3521:a message to remind him about 3426:02:31, 12 September 2007 (UTC) 983:User:SandyGeorgia/RaToPm issue 865:not resort to personal attacks 524:I dont´know how old are you... 13: 1: 4503:jumped ship on the discussion 4352:23:38, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4339:22:04, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4311:21:02, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4301:20:53, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4285:20:37, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4276:18:42, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4265:17:55, 9 September 2007 (UTC) 4256:, which may even result in a 4217:22:46, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4208:22:38, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4184:10:39, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4170:09:39, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4161:05:29, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4096:09:39, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4085:04:33, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 4067:15:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 4056:20:44, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 4024:16:10, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 4008:11:22, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3996:20:39, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3975:20:32, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3949:23:44, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3940:23:32, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3930:20:13, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3915:20:06, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3891:19:48, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3879:educate the rest of Knowledge 3835:16:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3777:03:18, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3755:02:48, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3743:01:28, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 3714:20:35, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3632:19:01, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3595:18:40, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3539:12:52, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3500:11:51, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 3403:03:35, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 3367:02:07, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 3317:01:27, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 3252:18:51, 3 September 2007 (UTC) 3072:04:04, 2 September 2007 (UTC) 2884:23:52, 1 September 2007 (UTC) 2802:05:33, 2 September 2007 (UTC) 2701:14:53, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 2674:17:11, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 2664:02:42, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 2653:20:22, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 2628:07:12, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 2611:13:55, 1 September 2007 (UTC) 2573:13:00, 1 September 2007 (UTC) 2547:06:12, 1 September 2007 (UTC) 2498:06:12, 1 September 2007 (UTC) 2238:Knowledge:No personal attacks 2037:04:39, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 2020:23:05, 7 September 2007 (UTC) 1860:01:26, 8 September 2007 (UTC) 1832:01:35, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1818:Well, I don't really think a 1802:01:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1774:01:18, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1755:01:15, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1733:01:05, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1705:22:58, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 1679:18:03, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 1670:17:34, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 1125:. The matter went to Arbcom ( 1090:23:29, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1080:16:11, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1059:15:02, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1037:14:01, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 1003:13:56, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 975:08:27, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 904:19:07, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 889:21:37, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 879:20:35, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 851:20:30, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 828:20:20, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 744:19:37, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 723:19:24, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 665:19:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 648:19:04, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 638:18:54, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 616:19:06, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 595:18:54, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 563:18:42, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 546:in the Portuguese Knowledge ( 544:has been blocked for one year 460:19:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 413:02:08, 6 September 2007 (UTC) 401:20:06, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 384:19:58, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 359:02:49, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 345:00:28, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 334:23:17, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 305:04:19, 5 September 2007 (UTC) 276:22:44, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 226:22:04, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 201:21:21, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 191:21:17, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 153:20:13, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 139:18:42, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 125:18:13, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 102:15:30, 4 September 2007 (UTC) 4560:, in fact. And yet he would 4547:). He seems to believe that 4377:Notable Usenet personalities 4373:a personal attack against me 4152:, where he actually filed a 3549:Knowledge talk:Build the web 2966:conflict by following me to 2900:one somehow had been reached 2898:that this was evidence that 2706:A long-simmering dispute at 1958:relatively minor issue... — 1256:Its disturbing to note that 7: 4240:, he seems to be violating 2793:20:27, 30 August 2007 (UTC) 2780:20:22, 30 August 2007 (UTC) 2769:13:39, 30 August 2007 (UTC) 2522:21:13, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2477:20:07, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2456:19:13, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2438:17:33, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2425:16:26, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2414:16:19, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2384:16:09, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2351:15:43, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 2333:14:45, 30 August 2007 (UTC) 2319:22:11, 29 August 2007 (UTC) 2298:21:49, 29 August 2007 (UTC) 2288:18:42, 29 August 2007 (UTC) 2271:18:37, 29 August 2007 (UTC) 1983:19:33, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1970:15:54, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1953:15:52, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1928:15:13, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1910:14:07, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1660:17:35, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1651:10:57, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1634:04:42, 28 August 2007 (UTC) 1559:11:15, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1547:03:01, 28 August 2007 (UTC) 1528:16:40, 27 August 2007 (UTC) 1512:07:59, 27 August 2007 (UTC) 1474:04:50, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1459:04:34, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1424:03:52, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1410:03:29, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1388:03:03, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1365:18:39, 28 August 2007 (UTC) 1355:03:01, 28 August 2007 (UTC) 1321:16:40, 27 August 2007 (UTC) 1309:07:28, 27 August 2007 (UTC) 1284:04:34, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1252:04:31, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1243:04:10, 31 August 2007 (UTC) 1229:03:01, 28 August 2007 (UTC) 1196:06:49, 27 August 2007 (UTC) 444:Recommended higher form of 221:- so please "explode" now. 10: 4837: 3961:Epbr123's exact words are 3845: 3436: 2821: 2686: 2049: 1879: 1687:has credibility among the 1102: 916: 779:Please make sure you read 475:1964 Brazilian coup d'état 433: 69: 4631:should have been used. -- 4570:User:georgewilliamherbert 4324:adding bulk bogus entries 1875:Ben & Jerry's flavors 1593:applies; anyone can edit. 1469:completely mystified me. 1327:politically charged terms 4784:blanked the notification 2931:Specific heat capacity’s 2735:User:PalestineRemembered 2168:Head of the Commonwealth 2043:Disruptive behaviour by 1978:I hope this is helpful. 985:and started a thread at 467:Fernando Collor de Mello 448:or Admin Noticeboard. — 184:perfectly valid policies 4367:just because the admin 4154:frivolous WQA complaint 4148:I would point everyone 2224:Knowledge:Verifiability 2164:Commonwealth of Nations 1523:. Please do read them. 1096:Possible incivility by 4566:no evidence whatsoever 4343:And now he's proposed 2947:Specific heat capacity 2927:this positive reaction 2919:Specific heat capacity 2894:record of dispute here 1683:In the same vein that 1640:Hindu Students Council 1605:, and exceptions are 1603:fundamental principle 42:of past discussions. 4712:That's interesting, 3692:Radiant's talk page. 3021:Request for Comments 2845:Request for Comments 2372:annoyance, not more. 1180:Bakasuprman contends 1160:, where the link to 368:Cheeser1's talk page 300:It was a joke dude. 4332:Assuming good faith 4258:request for comment 4246:no personal attacks 4102:Bayesian statistics 3447:Issue escalated to 3042:). Further, I said 3003:As regards Enuja’s 2992:see that discussion 1583:No personal attacks 1146:User talk:FCYTravis 861:Request For Comment 816:Hope this helps. — 268:assuming good faith 4665:. Another user is 3858:RFC has been filed 3647:takes two to tango 2850:Involved parties: 2405:tendentious editor 2234:Knowledge:Civility 2188:Commonwealth realm 2172:Monarchy in Canada 2156:God Save the Queen 1741:dispute resolution 1154:Talk:Romila Thapar 256:ignoring all rules 130:I've responded on 80:I recently tagged 4519:, as pointed out 4505:, because he has 4112: 3973: 3889: 3875:this conversation 3790: 3630: 3525:and the usage of 3138:assume good faith 2201:original research 1980:Sarcasticidealist 1925:Sarcasticidealist 1631: 1598:Assume good faith 1394:this edit summary 739:those disputes.-- 575:Admin Noticeboard 530:Talk:Plano Collor 331:Sarcasticidealist 136:Sarcasticidealist 58:WQA Archive index 54: 53: 48:current main page 4828: 4816:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4788:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4772:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4753:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4705:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4640: 4637: 4619:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4609: 4606: 4558:very proud of it 4491:this one instead 4361:On this very WQA 4308:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4298: 4295: 4282:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4262:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 4108: 4048: 3969: 3907: 3885: 3866:Joe Beaudoin Jr. 3851: 3850: 3786: 3769: 3706: 3655: 3626: 3520: 3511: 3496: 3494: 3492: 3490: 3488: 3451: 3442: 3441: 3352: 3343: 3198: 3189: 3135: 3126: 3119: 3110: 3103: 3094: 2827: 2826: 2703: 2692: 2691: 2277:User:TharkunColl 2176:British monarchy 2149: 2147: 2110: 2090: 2088:deleted contribs 2066: 2055: 2054: 2045:User:TharkunColl 2033: 2030: 2016: 2013: 1966: 1963: 1949: 1946: 1919:, but rather of 1906: 1903: 1885: 1884: 1701: 1696: 1619: 1617:Duae Quartunciae 1543: 1538: 1455: 1450: 1400:does not apply. 1384: 1379: 1351: 1346: 1280: 1275: 1225: 1220: 1115:User:Bakasuprman 1108: 1107: 1098:User:Bakasuprman 1033: 1031: 1029: 1027: 1025: 995: 971: 969: 967: 965: 963: 931: 922: 921: 462: 439: 438: 219:Knowledge:IGNORE 75: 74: 33: 32: 26: 4836: 4835: 4831: 4830: 4829: 4827: 4826: 4825: 4638: 4633: 4607: 4602: 4371:. He also made 4296: 4291: 4106:Septentrionalis 4046: 3967:Septentrionalis 3905: 3883:Septentrionalis 3854: 3853: 3848: 3844: 3784:Septentrionalis 3767: 3704: 3687:manual of style 3651: 3624:Septentrionalis 3507: 3506: 3486: 3484: 3482: 3480: 3478: 3452: 3446: 3444: 3439: 3435: 3339: 3338: 3185: 3184: 3122: 3121: 3106: 3105: 3104:, I agree with 3090: 3089: 3060:Respectfully, 3019:“I initiated a 2839:shows signs of 2830: 2829: 2824: 2820: 2815:'s behavior on 2708:Battle of Jenin 2704: 2696: 2694: 2689: 2685: 2681:Battle of Jenin 2222:cannot satisfy 2123: 2103: 2083: 2062: 2061: 2058: 2057: 2052: 2048: 2031: 2028: 2014: 2011: 1964: 1961: 1947: 1944: 1904: 1901: 1888: 1887: 1882: 1878: 1699: 1694: 1541: 1536: 1453: 1448: 1382: 1377: 1349: 1344: 1278: 1273: 1258:Willy on Wheels 1223: 1218: 1148:; for instance 1111: 1110: 1105: 1101: 1023: 1021: 1019: 1017: 1015: 993: 961: 959: 957: 955: 953: 932: 926: 924: 919: 915: 681: 463: 443: 441: 436: 432: 93:, and possibly 78: 77: 72: 68: 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 4834: 4824: 4823: 4822: 4821: 4780: 4779: 4778: 4777: 4749:RfC on Epbr123 4745: 4744: 4743: 4742: 4741: 4740: 4739: 4738: 4737: 4736: 4659: 4658: 4657: 4656: 4655: 4654: 4645: 4575:User:Dekkappai 4553:seems to think 4487: 4486: 4482: 4478: 4470: 4469: 4465: 4461: 4457: 4453: 4449: 4445: 4437: 4436: 4432: 4428: 4420: 4419: 4415: 4411: 4407: 4403: 4399: 4357: 4356: 4355: 4354: 4319: 4318: 4317: 4316: 4315: 4314: 4313: 4230: 4229: 4228: 4227: 4226: 4225: 4224: 4223: 4222: 4221: 4220: 4219: 4146: 4145: 4144: 4143: 4142: 4141: 4140: 4139: 4138: 4072: 4071: 4070: 4069: 4059: 4058: 4033: 4032: 4031: 4030: 4029: 4028: 4027: 4026: 3978: 3977: 3958: 3957: 3956: 3955: 3954: 3953: 3952: 3951: 3846: 3843: 3838: 3817: 3816: 3815: 3814: 3813: 3812: 3811: 3810: 3809: 3808: 3729: 3728: 3724: 3723: 3722: 3682: 3681: 3680: 3679: 3678: 3677: 3599: 3598: 3597: 3577: 3576: 3575: 3574: 3556: 3555: 3554: 3553: 3542: 3541: 3437: 3434: 3429: 3416: 3415: 3414: 3413: 3412: 3411: 3410: 3409: 3408: 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1035: 1034: 1010: 1009: 1008: 1007: 1004: 1000: 996: 988: 984: 979: 978: 977: 976: 973: 972: 949: 946: 943: 940: 936: 930: 912: 905: 902: 898: 897: 890: 887: 882: 881: 880: 876: 872: 871: 866: 862: 858: 857: 856: 855: 852: 849: 844: 840:Hello Kiefer, 839: 838: 837: 836: 829: 825: 821: 820: 815: 814: 813: 812: 811: 810: 802: 798: 794: 790: 786: 782: 778: 777: 776: 775: 774: 773: 764: 760: 755: 754: 753: 752: 751: 750: 745: 742: 738: 734: 729: 728: 727: 726: 725: 724: 721: 714: 710: 707: 703: 699: 697: 694: 690: 686: 683: 682: 666: 662: 658: 657: 651: 650: 649: 646: 641: 640: 639: 635: 631: 630: 624: 619: 618: 617: 614: 610: 606: 602: 598: 597: 596: 592: 588: 587: 581: 580: 576: 572: 567: 566: 565: 564: 561: 557: 553: 549: 545: 541: 537: 531: 528: 525: 521: 518: 515: 511: 509: 506: 502: 499: 496: 495: 494: 492: 488: 484: 480: 476: 472: 468: 461: 457: 453: 452: 447: 429: 425: 421: 414: 411: 406: 405: 402: 398: 394: 393: 388: 387: 386: 385: 382: 377: 373: 369: 360: 357: 352: 351: 350: 349: 346: 343: 338: 337: 336: 335: 332: 327: 323: 322:User:Cheeser1 306: 303: 299: 298: 297: 296: 295: 294: 293: 292: 291: 290: 289: 288: 277: 274: 269: 265: 261: 257: 253: 249: 245: 244: 243: 242: 241: 240: 239: 238: 237: 236: 227: 224: 220: 216: 215: 214: 213: 212: 211: 210: 209: 202: 199: 194: 192: 189: 185: 181: 177: 173: 169: 164: 163: 162: 161: 160: 159: 154: 151: 146: 145: 144: 143: 140: 137: 133: 129: 128: 127: 126: 123: 117: 114: 108: 104: 103: 100: 96: 92: 88: 83: 65: 60: 59: 49: 45: 41: 40: 35: 28: 27: 19: 4798: 4781: 4746: 4726:User:Epbr123 4722:my talk page 4686:trolling. -- 4683: 4682:, but it is 4679: 4666: 4660: 4634: 4603: 4582: 4565: 4532: 4524: 4488: 4471: 4438: 4421: 4392: 4364: 4358: 4292: 4231: 4197: 4175: 4153: 4128: 4013: 4000: 3985: 3962: 3937:Rocksanddirt 3872: 3862:User:Epbr123 3855: 3841:User:Epbr123 3824: 3818: 3732: 3730: 3683: 3657: 3650: 3641: 3637: 3619: 3615: 3611: 3604:this section 3584: 3477: 3461: 3453: 3417: 3396: 3310: 3301: 3296: 3291: 3065: 3048: 3043: 3035: 2987: 2983: 2979: 2972: 2963: 2959: 2946: 2942: 2930: 2922: 2899: 2897: 2875: 2870: 2864: 2858: 2852: 2849: 2831: 2762: 2758: 2753: 2751: 2748: 2743: 2739: 2731: 2721: 2718: 2705: 2657: 2639:this comment 2621: 2595: 2469: 2465: 2461: 2390: 2369: 2274: 2262: 2247: 2210: 2141: 2135: 2124: 2117: 2111: 2104: 2097: 2091: 2084: 2077: 2071: 2059: 2027: 2010: 1991: 1960: 1943: 1900: 1889: 1791: 1744: 1721: 1692: 1624: 1614: 1606: 1602: 1596: 1588: 1581: 1575: 1569: 1534: 1518: 1465: 1446: 1375: 1342: 1331:racial slurs 1298:good offices 1271: 1264: 1216: 1213:legitimately 1212: 1177: 1166: 1158:this comment 1150:this comment 1135: 1112: 1087:Rocksanddirt 1069: 1067: 1050: 1014: 952: 941: 933: 927:Referred to 901:Ludovicapipa 868: 864: 848:Ludovicapipa 817: 736: 720:Ludovicapipa 718: 654: 627: 584: 543: 539: 538: 535: 523: 513: 504: 471:João Goulart 464: 449: 420:Ludovicapipa 390: 365: 319: 259: 118: 112: 109: 105: 79: 55: 43: 37: 4800:KieferSkunk 4199:KieferSkunk 4015:KieferSkunk 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