User talk:Fram/Archive 16

2336:." without any source in the four years of their existence are a disgrace. "Unsourced or poorly sourced contentious material about living persons — whether the material is negative, positive, or just questionable — should be removed immediately and without waiting for discussion". If this material is the bulk of the article, the article should just go. G10 is quite clear about this: "a biography of a living person that is entirely negative in tone and unsourced, where there is no neutral version in the page history to revert to. Administrators deleting such pages should not quote the content of the page in the deletion summary, and if the page is an article about a living person it should not be restored or recreated by any editor until it meets biographical article standards." If you don't like the deletions, either recreate it as a decent, well sourced article (it is not as if I deleted a long page for one line of negative unsourced claims: the articles were stubs where the negative material was the essence), or take it to DRV. I will continue my scanning of as many BLPs as I can find, tagging the thousands of unsourced BLPs, and I will continue the deletion of all unsourced articles about supposed war criminals, nazi camp guards, porn artists, priests involved in sex scandals, and so on. All of you are welcome to write well-sourced articles about these persons, but I find it utterly amazing that all of you care so much about these articles 1617:

add details, which I did. I then found it had been removed with the aggressive comment of 'blatant advertising'. So why weren't the other similar entries from similar companies within the same article faced with the same rejection and abuse? My entry was simple straightforward explanation of what the company did. There was no soliciting for business. I had been impressed with Knowledge in the past, but this is sad. It was the first and the last time I try to contribute. I can only guess the selective nature of this administration was based on commercial preferences. Regards

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try to "salvage" an article with serious BLP violations when we can much easier delete it, and someone with real interest in it and knowledge of it can then create a good stub from scratch? What is lost by not having an article for a while? We didn't have the article for years, we still have glaring holes in our coverage of all kinds of everything, but these few articles, who no one could be bothered to clean in four years time, are so important that we cannot miss them for a few hours, days or weeks? The logic escapes me.

31: 2395:

the third paragraph on the prime minister of Rwanda and you have stub worthy of keeping---heads of state are worth keeping. Delete the second sentence in the other article, and move the allegation to just before his acquital, and you remove the BLP concern on an otherwise notable individual---Minister of Transport and Communications of Rwanda. Very little effort and both articles are salvagable. An existing stub on notable individuals is better than no article.---

609: 2843:. The most recent history page is filled with reverts of IP's. (BTW..The Sarah Palin article gets protected at the drop of an off-color hat. Right now it is protected for a month!). While I may have at one time been against protection, in general, I'm sure that you would agree how tedious and annoying it can be. Also, vandalism threatens Knowledge's reputation as a quality professional site. What can be done to "treat" this dangerous condition.-- 2716: 1647:. And a sentence like "they deliver a tailored service to ensure well-functioning stages, practical backstage facilities, comfortable auditoria and excellent audience circulation areas." is pure advertising. I'm sorry if this will mean that you will stop contributing, but we are an encyclopedia, not a list of all companies, and the article contained no encyclopedic information whatsoever (History? Achievements?). Please also check 2380:

been unsourced for years without being tagged. For the limited number of those that make serious negative allegations which are the major part of the article, the best solution is to delete them until someone comes along who wants to recreate it from scratch as a well-sourced article. You and everyone who has complained is free to be the creator of these acceptable articles: but I will not undelete any serious BLP violations.

1871:. Please go ahead and check user me whatever that may be and let me edit as I've always done - with an edit summary that is right in 99.9% of the cases and a clean record over all. I mean - I gave a false edit summary once and of course that is no good thing but my edit summary gives options of my older edit summaries every time a type a word and so I could have accidently put in a wrong one. 3943: 1779:, our main policy on this, states (in "Self-published and other questionable sources") that "self-published books, newsletters, personal websites, open wikis, blogs, knols, forum postings, and similar sources are largely not acceptable to cite in Knowledge." Knowledge is an open wiki, so it is not acceptable to cite Knowledge (or a copy of it) as a source for another Knowledge article. 2307:

performing the CSD should do this before deleting, but I know that's what should be done. If you aren't going to do the search yourself, then simply remove the contentious content. G10 is not a blanket exception allowing for the deletion of valid articles that have BLP concerns. BLP does not call for deletion of articles of otherwise notable individuals with BLP concerns.---

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so apart from highlighting some problems I will not be of much use. If you would want some assistance for any particular problems, I am always willing to help, but I will not make a serious effort to source all these articles. If I ever get finished with the tagging, I may take on the sourcing of a few categories of articles closer to my heart (like comics-related articles).

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War, the fleeing Belgians spoke Flemish, not Dutch. This is the kind of pretentiuosness of Dutch-oriented editors that prevent a simple mention of anything remotely Flemish. Months ago, I had a very lengthy and uncomfortable confrontation with the editor that reverted my attempt at clarity. I don't want to start another if I am off-base (wrong). Thank You. --

1743:"Anything on other language Wikipedias is just as free to use as anything here, so feel free to translate and use at will. It definitely won't get deleted for any copyright reasons, and the question of notability is helped by having articles in other languages. - Trevor MacInnis (Contribs) 14:54, 18 September 2008 (UTC)" 432:

recycle? So, they killed a lot of trees for no good reason. POD books will be printed only after a reader orders it, sometimes, Amazon or the publishers may stock a small quantity of the books that sell well. So, POD books will have a much smaller environmental impact than the books published by traditional publishers.

1513:(although a mention at the top would be more visible and obvious). And every editor willing to look for good sources and taking civil criticism so positively is a benefit for Knowledge, so welcome! By the way, I don't know if you noticed the page yet, but an admin has created a page with pageview statistics. 1811:... so you think I am a sockpuppetteer, how nice is that! Why did you not tell me, I mean - you made those comments on me over a week ago. How am I linked to vandals - all I do is promoting some articles of a Native American figure, is that such a terrible thing to do? This seems like overreacting to me. 781:(I'll reply in English :-) ) I'll try to keep an eye on him. If he (or she) would only try to discuss the edits, we might get somewhere... As for blocking: the edits are not bad enough (or frequent), and he is using a number of other IP's anyway, so a block may be a nuisance to him but won't stop him. 3655:

page came up on my machine on two different occasions as a cut-and-paste of the sandbox page under a bizarre title. The text that's currently up on the article was not what I'd deleted. Might have been a computer glitch on my end, but all I know is what I saw and that's what I based my decision on.

3500:

Hi, you recently renamed the page to have a lower case "h" for hotels instead of a capital "h". Clicking on a link to the upper case version does not automatically redirect you to the renamed page but instead you get an intermediate page with the link to the lower case version. Is there any way you

2514:

Could you please elaborate on your deletion of our page 'Cobent Limited'. I can understand why based on the reason that it is a 'Company page' - which is fair enough if it was applied to all companies. I am just abit puzzled as to why a competitor company's wiki page has not been delete given that it

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on a supposed Al Qaeda member: created in 2005, it was tagged as needing references since 2006: it should have been deleted long ago, but no one could be bothered. We have a two-year backlog on articles tagged as "unsourced": about one in twelve of those are BLPs. We have many more articles that have

2152:

Hi. I've noted your comments a few weeks ago and earlier today. I recall agreeing with you on some issues previously and posting replies to that effect. I'd like to assure you that I'm a reasonable fellow and that I'm back with a sincere interest in doing what's right for the project; this has always

1862:

As I've tried to tell you, Fram, I have never intentionally vandalised anything! All I have ever done has been done in good faith. I came to this website to edit seriously. I have removed a citation template because I saw the statement made in the article already was covered by the given references -

521:

I need your advice. Please refer to the Dutch (ethnic group) article/Modern Era section and one of my edits of Nov 7th . Would it not be factual that those Belgians that fled into The Netherlands spoke various Flemish dialects rather than Dutch. Am I wrong to think that at the time of the First World

431:

Traditional publishers use off-set printing, i.e., they need to print a large quantity (for example, 2,000 to 5,000 copies) for each print run. The problem is 90% of the books published by traditional publishers. What are they going to do with all these books that they cannot sell? Throw them away or

3839:

No worries, the current backlog for unsourced articles is nearly two and a half years, so there's no rush :-) I'm going through all the stubs, country by country, and afer having pfinished India I am now at Indonesia. It is, in all honesty, just drive-by tagging, I'm not even watchlisting the pages,

3766:

Crudo: you deleted it as Crudo band at 03:38 the 16th. It was at that time only one minute old, and did not contain any wikilinks. The names included in it were pretty well known and easily wiki-searchable (or googlable). For attack pages and truly non notable A7s (X is the greatest girl alive!) and

2414:

A new stub without a history full of BLP violations is better than keeping the history. Compare it to an article with extensive copyright violations throughout the history: we don't trim it down to a copyright free version, we delete it completely, even if it is about a notable subject. Why would we

2394:

That article, which is about a real person and events, probably should be deleted as it is solely about the incident, he has zero notability outside the allegation of being involved in a terrorist organization. The two cited above, could have been tweaked with minimal effort. Eg delete the most of

2374:

Obviously speedy deletions can be misapplied and misused. I have tagged over 2,000 articles as unsourced BLPs in the last few weeks, and a few hundred or so more as simply unsourced. I have deleted only a big handful of those. It is better to lack a few correct but unsourced articles, than to have a

1703:

In general, every page needs to have their own sources. Other Knowledge pages canget changed, people can get added to your list where the corresponding Wiki page is not adequately sourced, ... The list can stay without sources, it will not get deleted for that reason, butit would be better if it was

1373:

Although I had contribued before to other articles, admittedly this is the first time I actually created one from scratch and left it a couple of days. For that I apologize. I have updated the article and I hope it meets the basic standards at least. If there is anything that needs to be improved

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It's late here, and I'm working full-time for the next few days, but I think the referencing/linking needs serious cleanup too. I'm not strictly clear on image link policy, but I'm fairly sure it's not considered good practice to hyperlink out to lots of photos on random websites just so we know (in

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The traditional publishers are NOT better than self-published books, in fact, they are NOT sensitive to market demand, and take too long to produce books, and most of them do not sell anyway. The main purpose of a book is to provide good information to readers in a timely manner. What is the point

2199:

I am disappointed to see you speedily deleting articles because of BLP. Though I know this is the policy, you should have looked for sources. I am positive you would have found at least enough to keep the articles you just deleted, if only in a seriously paired down state. Now, it is unlikely those

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I can understand that. My experience in Flanders is that people identify as Flemish, Belgian, ... (taking often different identifications, being both Flemish and Belgian and so on), but never Dutch (excepting those of clearly recent Dutch ancestry, and someof those supporting the unification of the

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I would not alphabetize it, e.g. the last two entries should stay at the end. Similarly, I would not alphabetize the categories, although I would put the category "Moses" first (and probably remove it from the "see also" section). The "further reading" section is an example of an alphabetized list

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Wow, I didn't see that . While you are right, I have to say that that is a very hard to spot reference. Clearly reliable obviously, part of ESPN so no problem there. No objection to my tags being removed when the infobox is sourced, but could you find a way to make that ref easier to find (a notes

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and added names of some people who had lived in this city to it , but you said they are "unsourced", I wanted to say that if you go to pages related to each of those people in wikipedia , you could see that they are from Lahijan. so Why should I give more refrences ? If I cite the wiki pages of

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Hello, I am new to Knowledge, but was researching an article recently about a new opera house which mentioned the key firms involved in its design, development and building. Each one had a link describing the company concerned, but one link for a company I knew well was empty with an invitation to

3675:

To follow up: I wasn't the first to have deleted the "Shannon Marie" entry. NawlinWiki had done so just before I did. I remember deleting something regading "crudo," but the link you sent wasn't what I deleted, or even would have. I do admit that I may have been a little trigger-happy on that

2354:

I don't care about the articles, I care about the people who go around deleting articles that shouldn't be deleted. Speedy Deleters can be as big of a bain to the project as the vandals they are trying to protect the project from. Careless/hasty speedy deleters (and I am not saying that you are

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but haven't looked at G10 yet. The deletion of these two articles IMO are further examples of over eager deleters, which is what gives CSD a bad name. Both of these articles are worthy of keeping... yes, the BLP concerns could, no should be deleted, until sourced. In an ideal world, the person

2277:

Since our policy currently says that G10 deleted articles "should not be restored or recreated by any editor until biographical article standards.", and since we don't agree on this yet, I will not restore them. But I urge you to reconsider your decision. Also, I urge you to be more careful with

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would help, but certainly when you hace words like "tessarae" or "kiln", a link is useful (even if it is a redlink, then at least we know that it needs an article :-) ). Don't get me wrong, it is an interesting article, and very well sourced, but it could use a lot of work, and can still use some

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Not really. Pages are only marked that are taken under "the Empire's" wing. Look past the corny empire thing and please see the true potential of this project. Imagine a Knowledge where every page has a guardian, and you will understand my project. The Empire bit is just to make it more enjoyable

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and his failed drugs test and sponsorship. They were provided in an external link which I have turned into a reference. I hope this is helpful to you and the article itself. I would advise you to please read through the article carefully which fully explains his failed drugs test, his fine and

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As for the current state of the article: while it is a lot better than a few months ago, it is not very good still. Way too many images for starters, no really logical structure, Culture and History sections which aren't truly started yet... There is a lot more information than there was a while

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Hello, Fram. Can you take a look at the above and my suggestion of today? I believe it is a better explanation and clearer Lead. I feel it is necessary to inform the reader of the subtle and yet important difference between Flemish and Dutch. The "Dutchification" of everything Belgian/Flemish is

3573:

The only thing I can imagine that would excuse it (apart from being a true story after all, which is very doubtful) is that he created the page from a request on "request for article creation" (I don't know the exact name, so can't link it, butwe do have something like that floating around). If

2167:

No thanks, I'm not interested. If you behave reasonably, I'll leave you well alone. Your behaviour (pre-block I mean) was appalling, even if we agreed on some aspects of the fiction discussions. I don't like White Cat at all (as an editor here, I have no idea what kind of person he is and it is

309:

Hello Fram. I have an idea (see light bulb above my head). Instead of arguing with good faith editors at the Dutch (ethnic group) article, why not create a seperate Flemish (ethnic group) article. When a reader searches for Flemish in the Main list of Ethnic Groups the closest he/she can get is

3342:

Because there is no such thing as those terms you explained above. Professional wrestling is a complex thing to understand, and this is one of them, organizations list the holders of the titles as "Champion" because they reflect the name of the actual championship. You wouldn't say List of WWE

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series. There is currently a discussion concerning the merging of all individual articles on Smurf video games into one bigger article. I do not believe that any of the editors involved in the discussion (myself included) know much about the games and I was hoping you could provide us with the

1512:

Thanks! The source you give there is at first glance a very good one, a Museum website should be reliable and relevant for the subject. As for Nationmaster Encyclopedia, normally they reference Knowledge at the very bottom of the page, in small grey print, so I think that is nominally allright

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I have no objection to the existence of self-publishers, and can see why people use it. That does not mean that we should accept such sources as reliable sources though, since the risk of unreliable information in such sources is much higher. If I find evidence that a self-published source has

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A separate article about the Flemish group may be useful, but I don't like articles about ethnic groups in general, since these labels are becoming more and more meaningless. However, whether we ave that article or not, the article on the Dutch should contain correct and balanced info, not the

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14:55, 20 January 2009 (UTC) I have followed your contribs and will try - but it will take ages - the issue is that in many cases english deprived eds add stubs with nothing to support them as a copy from the id project. There seems no acknowledgement in that project to utilise anything that

2331:

Funny how everyone now is so concerned about these articles, but couldn't be bothered to do anything about them in the years they were unsourced BLP violations. I will not be more careful with deletions in the future, articles that start with "He is chiefly known for his alleged role in the

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Bayan Knights premiered Nov. 22 and is considered a milestone in Philippine Comics history as the first time a single comic involves creations of individual authors are joined as a team with individual rights retained. Admittedly the article is a work in progress, however the notability is

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two countries). So I beleive that while an article on the Dutch as an athnic group should mention (at length) that while a number of people believe that Flemings are part of the group, many people disagree with this, both among the Flemish and among the independent researchers / literature.

1548:

Sorry, Fram, comments were addressed to you because I thought yours were addressed at me. My recent wiki-experience is dominated by nutcase users and negativity, and I'm seeing things like that too quickly. I'll remove the whole correspondence, if you don't mind, as it's a distraction. :)

801:

You removed the reference to NationMaster claiming it is a copy of Knowledge. Obviously it can't be an exact copy of Knowledge since it has additional information on some topics that Knowledge doesn't have. Even the Knowledge article on NationMaster says they take data from many sources:

369:. I don't say that is the most important, but I edit this image in order to have images linked to some companies which have often no images. And I put this image before developping two or three lines about Casterman. But... What do you think of this page in general? Now? Sincerely, 423:

My experience is different: I am a book reviewer for bookpleasures, and I have read many books. Most of the self-published books that I read are of high quality, they are simply published via a different channel. The authors for these books put in a lot of time and effort.

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The IP address' user page is now semi-protected, so that should choke this guy off. I'm a little annoyed, since I gave the guy a chance to demonstrate some good faith and he stomped on it. To put it another way, he threw his shoes at us. However, it should have been expected.

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received mainstream attention or is used as a reference by reliable sources or publications, then we have established that said self-published source is of sufficient quality or importance to be included. This is however the execption to the default position of excluding them.

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case we've weak powers of imagination) what wolfberries look like in a bowl of rice or a cup of hot water. Also, too many links to commercial sites ... HTML hyperlinks for internal Knowledge text ... and news stories in External links that aren't actually used as references.

1746:

It is obviously illogical for an administrator to say I can use a source, , and actually encourage it, and then say I can't cite it. I do believe you erred when you deleted my citation to French Knowledge. There is no question of faulty or ambiguous translation in a date.

2239:. You had two years to do something about this blatant BLP violation, but you blame me? You can be disappointed as much as you like, but don't blame me for acting according to one of our most funcamental policies while you pointedly ignored it for at least two years. 2375:

few incorrect negative BLPs. My speedies were not "hasty", the articles had existed for years without anyone bothering to add even one source to them. They were not "works in progress" that were deleted before the editor(s) had a chance to finish them. Take e.g.

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one, I've not looked at your other deletions) need to be curbed. (There are a few admins that I know of who speedy just about everything regardless of whether or not it fits the proper criteria---take a look at the reviews I did on A1 and G1 deletions.)---

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the one that put it there in the first place has not thoroughly read those and is to blame. And I made a redirect which I considered appropriate - so what? That does not sound like any serious vandalism in my eyes! I've even made an article here recently,

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You recently tagged this article as requiring a cleanup. I'm happy to attempt this (for example I have expanded the lead para to include definition and order), but it would be helpful if you could let me know what aspects particularly need cleaning up.

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outside aticles which deal directly with the subject at hand. To use it here would be an illustration, not a necessity to better understand the article. Of course Casterman and Tintin and Hergé are very famous, no need to convince me (hey, I wrote the

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in May 2007. Although the article may have failed to express it, this is a notable firm. I am not sure what condition the article was in when it was deleted. It would be great if you could restore the text as a subpage in my user space

3776:

Of course it would be much, much better if people created better articles, but how can you expect people to learn this if their first honest effort gets instantly deleted, in some cases as vandalism with a warning to never do such thing

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I don't mean to point an accusation but I think the Dutch have a difficult time understanding the position of the Flemish. It has to do with their self-proclaimed feelings of superiority, IMHO. I will copy this idea to SPQRobin for his

439:

Knowledge is a self-published encyclopedia, does it mean it is not as good as the traditional encyclopedia? You are an editor for Knowledge, does it mean you are not as good as an editor for traditional encyclopedia? Think about it.

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benefit of your opinion as an editor knowledgeable about the subject. If you are not interested in helping or if you believe yourself incapable at this time then please disregard this message. The discussion is currently under way

3753:

About Conficker: you deleted it as A1, not enough context. You could have deleted it as A3 (lack of content) or A7 (webcontent), but the context was there, Conficker is a computer virus. And somewhat notable, with 300 pageviews a

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Hi! This article, which you deleted under G11 at 12:25 GMT today, is back already. What's the best appraoch here - to keep tagging for speedy, or to take it to AFD (and risk there'll be no consensus to delete), or what?

435:

I have dealt with both traditional publishers and "self-published" publisher. The traditional publishers only pay author one or two dollars per book, how can you attract talented writers if you only pay them that little?

2274:. These facts were not disputed. I have seen many articles regarding ethnic conflicts, and when they're as fair as these two articles, then we can consider ourselves lucky! Deleting such articles does Knowledge no good. 2257:

is for articles that "serve no purpose but to disparage or threaten their subject". This clearly is not the case for either of the articles. Naturally, they contained some critical statements, but what do you expect?!

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utterly irrelevant), but how you treated him was despicable. You are unblocked, you can edit productively now, but that does not mean that I'll change my opinion of you or have any interest whatsoever to chat with you.

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Knowledge is a self published encyclopedia, and Knowledge is not considered a reliable source by Knowledge itself. Furthermore, my position on self published sources is the standard Knowledge policy, as established in

2678:

It does make our life easier. The final edits of Jouke and the IP were so similar that anyone who wold wonder if it couldn't have been truly a school admin will have no doubts left about the validity of either block.

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That is because of the bias that "advanced" users develop against these sort of new ideas. Why don't you tag the Knowledge Fun Committee with deletion? Oh, because its an established idea. Give my idea a chance as

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Fram thanks for helping at CFS, IP 88.97.5.228 now editing article also, controversial and non medrs without discussing, is also London, same as the 87 IPs probably same person. I agree about semiprotect. Thx,

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I was going through the new pages. Since the other companies did not have new pages, I never looked at them. We have 2.5 million articles, I can harly check them all. As for the article: the company is not

3619:(go to Museum Gallery, and then to Eye of Tyr). I did not compare the earlier article with the new one until now, so I had not noticed this problem yet. We really need an explanation from Lifebaka... 3002:

I intend to remove most of them, because in most cases, the article is a one-line stub, and the single sentence is a prosification of the infobox, which does have a reference attached at the bottom.

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All lists have the "C" in Champions capitalized because the "Champion" is apart of the name of the Championship. ECW Tag Team Championship is the name and the holders were ECW Tag Team Champions. --

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okay man, i've had it with you and wikipedia - i left, don't bother banning me but if you can't resist, then go ahead and bring it on! you guys gave me a hard time, i'm done with this shit. see ya!

820:

You may be right though... I found an old version of this page on Knowledge that is identical to the one on NationMaster. So the NationMaster page may be a copy of this older version of the page. --

679:

The edit summary does not mention either "Flemish" or "removal". I have no idea who removed the Frisians or why, and have no objections to reinserting them, but your summary was clearly misleading.

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And the new article is significantly similar to the old one, so we may have a GFDL problem as well, and a copyright violation problem. The article was deleted (by me) as a copyright violation from

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Hello I have updated the Nick Danger and the Danger City Rebels page and added sources and I was wondering if you could coach me a bit on this article as I am new to writing on Knowledge. - Jamie

3602:) and you moved it because Tyr wasn't capitalized. Those 2 edits are deleted, the first non-deleted edit is from Lifebak and the edit summary says 'starting article'. Can you make sense of that? 664:

I did not mislead anyone. The edit summary notes that "as explained in article" the Flemish are more than a mere related people, whereas the Frisians were removed (why?) and I'm reinstating them.

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Hi! I noticed that you speak Dutch. If you get a chance, could you take a look at this article? I'm not sure which language it is in, or if the subject is notable enough for an article. Thanks!

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Ik heb gezien dat je ook overhoop ligt met 212.68.199.178, kunnen we die niet ergens aangeven voor permanente blokkering? Die werkt mij zodanig op de zenuwen dat ik er grijs haar van krijg. --

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with a new entry tagged on at the bottom: this entry should either be removed (and it does look like a not very scientific book anyway), or if kept included at the correct spot in that list.

3574:

that's the case, then he just AGF too much and didn't check enough, which is slightly careless but not a serious mistake. I hope this is the case, otherwise I would indeed raise it at ANI.

2051:

Thanks, that will do. Normally, something should be bolded at the start of the intro, but with lists, this is sometimes harder to achieve in a natural way. Thanks for all the work on this!

835:

Yes, Nationmaster is a copy of an old Knowledge version (often from 2005). I have not checked the origin of this Natinamster article, but all these articles are straight Knowledge copies.

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You are free to translate articles (or parts of them) from other Wikipedias, as long as you indicate that you have done so. However, that does not mean that Knowledge (or any wiki) is a

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The article I was currently working on for Bayan Knights has been deleted with the reason: "Bayan Knights" ‎ (A7 (web): No indication that the article may meet guidelines for inclusion)

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Thanks for your involvement in this discussion. My vantage point is as a Fleming living in the USA for 50+ years. We considered ourselves either Flemish or Belgian, but never Dutch. --

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As well as the automatic notification I've told him his behaviour is being discussed on the AfD. In fact, I am just wondering when it should be brought up at ANI. What do you think?

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and get more opinions. And Fram, I agree with you on some of these, but when a stub has been around for years, and no one else has complained about it, sometimes it's better to do a

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I think it is best to take it to AfD. The article has a number of sources and some claims to notability. If it is kept at AfD, so be it. It needs to be moved and cleaned of course.

3786:

As for your email: I prefer discussing things in the open, the good with the bad (apart from privacy issues). We should not hide our disagreements, errors, ... from other editors.

3735:. Everything that needed to be done was removing the sandbox header. It may have been a glitch, but the current text is the text you deleted. And deleted as G3 vandalism as well... 2298:

because of a recent essay I wrote on CSD.) One of the things I've been looking at lately are the way in which our CSD system is being abused and misused. I've already looked at

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been my intent. Perhaps we could chat a bit? Email's fine, if you prefer. I've had quite a bit of dialogue with a great many folks prior to my return; talk does wonders. Cheers,

393:" article and many others on Belgian comics), but that is not sufficient to have such an image. (By the way, there are also Tintins in Ostends, Brussels, and Antwerps dialect). 3882: 3372:

Well, I will not contest it, I guess arguments can be made for both, so keeping the situation as it is is not problem. On the other hand, I have started a move discussion for

1486:

I confirmed that those entries (Fasanenstrasse Synagogue} actually ARE identical, then found what I hope is a better reference - at least it is significantly more detailed! -

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You weren't the first one to delete Shannon Marie, but the first to delete it as vandalism, when it was just an A7 from an editor who hasn't gotten a clue about Knowledge

1246:

No, I simply ignored that quip about contradicting myself because your statement failed to explain itself so that I could understand it. 09:47, 21 November 2008 (UTC)

292:

BTW...The recent archive (#6) doesnt work right when accessed from the User box....I think you have Capitalized some of the letters. I would fix but I don't know how.--

3932: 122:, I was writing on the grounds that it was in the wrong namespace?? I'm sorry if I put it in the wrong place. What is the correct location for proposed policies? -- 3982: 3510: 156: 137: 3299:

I'm sorry, but this is how the respective companies spell the name of the holders of the championship. Like the World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE) Champion(ship)--

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It was speediable for lack of content; it was, IMO, up to the poster to have done the bit of extra work necessary to properly describe this in the first place. --

3328:

On the other hand, you have ECW Tag Team competitors, ECW Tag Team referees, ECW Tag Team runner-ups, etcetera. Why make an exception for the actual champions?

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I love this process…putting the article up (though I still want to do more on it) has led to quite a number of small, helpful changes — yours, and others! —

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Yes, they need much more work and cleaning. Way too much emphasis on the superfood angle anyway, they are plants first and potential health foods second.

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Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because, even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the

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If I have to start the article over, that's fine. I would like a detailed explanation however as to why it would be deleted in the first place.

991: 202: 673: 568:. The edits do appear verifiable, but newspaper sources (of which there are plenty) would be more credible than the website of a darts company. 3711: 3685: 3444:

I have no idea of a similar template for missing people, no. Tagging it is unreferenced is certainly allright. Perhaps something to discuss at

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You were correct in restoring the article to its current version, however, I would never have deleted this had I seen what I'm seeing now.--

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I have userfied it. Article was prodded long ago (and could frankly have been speedy deleted as a A7 no assertion of notability). Good luck!

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Before I wrote and referenced this article, I inquired about using Wikipedias in other languages. I am quoting you the guidance I was given:

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I've removed the tag following expansion of the lead and increasing the links to other articles. Have a look and see whether it needs more.

2032: 1651:: if you have a link to the company (writing press releases for them or so), it is best if you don't write articles on them on Knowledge... 931: 4229: 4133: 4117: 3913:

I think that the same image needs to be re-uploaded with a different name, but I'm not really very familiar with the whole file namespace.

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It appears the deletion of that article as "personal attack page" was for the wrong reason. There is currently a discussion about this at

1788: 510: 406: 3294: 3039: 2952: 1852: 3795: 3533: 3127:, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past, a good friend, or just some random person. Don't eat yellow snow! 3628: 3611: 3583: 3463: 2873: 2424: 2409: 2389: 2369: 2349: 1761: 844: 323: 3588:

Now I am really confused. I looked at the 2 deleted edits (which I should have done). The article was created in October last year by

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You are contradicting yourself because of the bias of advanced users? I'll continue this discussion when you have better arguments...

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Yeah, I suspected that. But I didn't want to make it a subpage of mine lest the other editor think it somehow belonged to me. Thanks.

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For many championships, the name is the X Championships but the winners are the X champions. But you are free to revert my moves per

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It certainly is no longer speedyable, and it looks notable to me. Thanks for arguing against the deletion and improving the article!

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Thank you for the translation! I've added the bio template to the talk page, but will leave for others to decide notability. Cheers!

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Required notice to all parties involved with the Guido den Broeder ban/block/discussion: I have appealed the ban on his behalf at

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I don't understand why you removed immediately the image of Tintin. Casterman in Tournai is very famous and there is a book of

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unquestioned as it has been recognized notably in a major article of a National broadsheet. See here for the link to the story:

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sources, all those with only unreliable sources (like personal webpages) will still be untagged. We can't do it all at once...

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Thanks for the notification. Barely notable, but just passes IMO. Translated, still unsourced, but has some articles in e.g.

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sucked into the dark abyss of the indonesia project i see - well there will be no rush from eds to fix all that - good luck

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so on, instant speedying is the best solution: for many other A7s and A3s, a very simple search is often a better solution.

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Saw that a few minutes after I left this, was chasing the discussion all over the wiki, it seemed. Glad you found it.

775: 4241: 3642: 3434: 1281: 378: 3563: 1966: 531: 2753: 2560: 2321: 2014:, you can't go from this page to other Knowledge pages by links except for the Thurrock link (added since) and the 864: 3217: 1893: 1833: 558: 2792: 2757: 2088: 1065: 1015: 412: 2618: 2549: 1590: 1555: 1468: 1354:. Now all there was, was the link to a blog, without any claim to notability or any link to a reliable source. 337:

one-sided view it has now (or had in a number of recent versions, I haven't checked the version of today yet).

2734:, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process because of the following concern: 4088: 4058: 3829: 3229: 3056: 2303: 2299: 1435: 1309: 3524:, it automatically gets me to the new page. Can you tell me what link you are using to access the old page? 3520:

That's bizarre: there is no double redirect as far as I can see, and when I access the older page from e.g.

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Allow me to chime in, as one of the people who helped shape our speedy deletion criteria several years ago.

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why did you delete our band page on Knowledge? I was still editing it, it wasn't even remotely finished...

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and hopefully this note has made your day a little better. Spread the WikiLove by wishing another user a

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Done :) I just took one from the BBC. The other one regarding sponsorship I just deleted it. Cheers!

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I'll restore the article. In the future, please try to make it clearer how the subject of an article is

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You have bias against self-published (print-on-demand, or POD) books, and I think you are dead wrong.

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which was well referenced and has been greatly expanded by user Ephriam with whom I have worked on

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We'll see... And as I have pointed out on your user page, you have repeatedly vandalized articles.

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BTW, while you are there, how does one correct the spelling in the name of an Image file, such as

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Hello, User:Fram. I have noticed from your user page that you are a fan of or have an interest in

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notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on

1490:(I noticed that I could find no mention of WP on the Nationmaster page, but that is S E P (SEP)!) 2830: 1757: 1642: 901: 470: 1487: 565: 483: 4189: 3946:

Hello, Fram. This message is being sent to inform you that there currently is a discussion at

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Do you know, is there a similar template for missing people? Or should missing people just be

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It was (and is) mainly the intro. It has significantly improvedn but needs some expansion and

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http://showbizandstyle.inquirer.net/sim/sim/view/20081026-168534/In-Search-of-Real-life-Heroes

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Knowledge:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents#User:Tabletop unnecessary white-space changes

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biographies will be rewritten, when they could have been saved with a simple google search.--

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You are contradicting yourself. "Imagine a Knowledge where every page has a guardian" =: -->

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can correct this so that the redirection happens automatically please? Thanks in advance.

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could have done that simple google and source in those year and a half inbetween? Another?

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I agree, I will continue to make a number of changes, but I will not revert you any longer.

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instead of a speedy. That way the article still gets deleted, but with far less drama. --

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Almost forgot: The total original content of the Conficker computer virus entry was:

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it's fairly clear how useful a user this guy would have been. Thanks for your help.

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Proposed deletion of Chuvash State University Faculty Working with Foreign Students

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I am working on creating articles on notable private equity firms as part of the

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Suggest you file a checkuser - what was the link to the older checkuser request?

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All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Knowledge's

46:

If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the

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Thanks, finally!! Now just to keep an eye on new socks, but these I can safely

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You Belgian? Cool... I am Dutch. We could just talk in our native language. :)

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No it wasn't. I think this largely depends on your prejudice when reading it.

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Championship champions would you? No, because Champions does the same job.--

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Could you be so kind and get it online again, so I can complete editing it?

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about you, but I have to admit it went that way. I replied to your post at

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regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. —

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to produce a lot of books by traditional publishers but cannot sell them?

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I thought you'd be interested in and might like to comment on the above.

3088: 220:. It does not seem likely that the band meets our inclusion guidelines. 3892:

Picture files do not seem to have a "move" button that allow renaming.

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a non-notable list of faculty, in a NN department; written as an essay

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provides the same information that I have provided about our company?

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If you could shed some light on this, it would be much appreaciate.

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Nice of you to take the time and effort to respond! Best regards, --

486:. If you want to change that policy, you will have to take it up at 4233: 3822:

resembes a RS - oh well thanks fo uncovering them anyways - cheers

3732:, and you deleted that as well. The version you deleted is this one 3426:'d? Evidently, this template's not quite right, as it adds them to 362: 3985:, before they could cause serious damage to Wikipdia. Good work. 2840: 870:

If you prefer, I can move it to his userspace, or project space.

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And just like that, Poof!, he's gone (except on his user page).

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has received over 5,000 viewers the day it was on the main page!

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Thanks for pointing out the Nationmaster/Wikipedia "violation"!

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Chuvash State University Faculty Working with Foreign Students

2018:

link (already there when I tagged it). Linking to things like

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I moved this from your userpage, hope that's not a problem. --

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Conficker is a computer virus that surfaced in January, 2009.

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http://www.bh.org.il/Communities/Synagogue/Fasanenstrasse.asp

3098: 2787:, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the 2456:

My apologies. I did not originally mean to write my post at

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Yes, please move it to the project space, which is neutral.

3885:? Image:Febuary 21 Lunar Eclipse.jpg|Eclipse observed from 2126: 619: 3492:

List of hotels of the London, Midland and Scottish Railway

2764:). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the 2516: 2433:. My advice is to take a couple of the disputed stubs to 1374:

on , your feedback would be most appreciated. Thank you.

942:

Hi Fram, don't know if you were watching the AfD but you

2756:, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also " 4155:

As a non-Nederlands-speaking American, I can only say,

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company stub. I hope this addresses your concerns. --

3651:

Hi. I just shot you an e-mail re. your concerns. The

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Thanks in advance and best regards from Germany, Andy

237:

Knowledge talk:Biographies of living persons#BLP prod

4116:You better discuss this with the admin that closed 397:ago, but it is hard to digest in its current form. 155:Could you please recover the deleted contents from 3933:ANI: User:Tabletop unnecessary white-space changes 2520: 2223:: I deleted it today, you tagged it as a stub in 2901:. I noticed you deleted an article started for 2091:so that people there can discuss it properly? — 3139:}} to their talk page with a friendly message. 2839:Ive been noticing a high level of vandalism at 3977:Just wanted to stop in and thank you for your 2473:Thanks. I'll move over there and have a look. 1195:His.Wikian.Majesty,Emperor.Victor.of.Knowledge 1134:His.Wikian.Majesty,Emperor.Victor.of.Knowledge 960:Thanks, I have discussed it on his talk page. 501:. You should not add links to your own books. 3156:Hello Fram, happy new year ! Can you restore 1291:difficult to explain to the casual visitor.-- 4118:Knowledge:Articles for deletion/Mark Libbery 3883:250px|frame|Squadron 66 (misspelled Squadon) 2105:Replied there, thanks for the notification. 1164:every article is tagged for this project... 1033:. Is a member of the provincial council... 4012:I would suggest going ahead with changing 3843:By the way, I have only tagged those with 1903:This whole thing is seriously disturbing! 806:I'm putting it back for the time being. -- 541:Hi, I see you reverted my edits regarding 2632:. Feel free to follow up if you want to. 628:was updated with a fact from the article 2994:Your tagging of South African cricketers 2930: 2926: 2911: 2517:http://en.wikipedia.org/SumTotal_Systems 2235:was deleted today, and edited by you in 2135: 1977:List of archaeological sites in Thurrock 1644:. The company has never been in the news 660:Accusations of misleading Edit Summaries 546:suspension and his loss of sponsorship. 136:haha--- my bad, I caught it. it was in 4097:I need these pages unprotected. thanks 4014:List of Great Lakes Hockey League teams 4004:List of Great Lakes Hockey League Teams 2730:template has been added to the article 365:translated in the regional language of 14: 3119:! This greeting (and season) promotes 1684:them , would it be enough to verify ? 44:Do not edit the contents of this page. 3430:, where they should not really be. - 3239:Moving ECW Tag Team Championship list 3164:(or can you do it yourself). Thanks. 3131:Spread the holiday cheer by adding {{ 4045:Just wanted your advise: Should the 3867:Spelling errors in Image files names 3522:London, Midland and Scottish Railway 2910:and I will get it in shape. Thanks 1750:Would you care to correct yourself? 804:http://en.wikipedia.org/NationMaster 25: 3065:I fixed the cite you tagged in the 23: 3097: 2908:User:Urbanrenewal/Harvest Partners 2714: 2597: 2278:speedy deletions in the future. — 1945: 1904: 1872: 1812: 24: 4254: 3069:article. Thanks for catching it. 173:no worries-- got it elsewhere. -- 3941: 3160:, I will add a FUR to use it in 2521:http://en.wikipedia.org/ToolBook 2429:FYI, this is being discussed at 1189: 1128: 607: 159:and place them on my talk or on 118:You deleted a proposed policy, 29: 3473: 3376:at the talk page there (and at 3030:section in the article or so)? 2920: 2915: 4206: 4201: 2628:I posted a note about this at 2611: 2604: 2599: 2398: 2358: 2310: 2087:. Do you see any objection to 1959: 1952: 1947: 1918: 1911: 1906: 1886: 1879: 1874: 1826: 1819: 1814: 1220:09:43, 21 November 2008 (UTC) 1208:For Royal Inquests, Click Here 1157:09:37, 21 November 2008 (UTC) 1147:For Royal Inquests, Click Here 171:) 05:55, 4 November 2008 (UTC) 13: 1: 3757:and lots of Google News hits. 3728:, the author recreated it as 3162:Characters in Asterix#Getafix 3040:08:26, 22 December 2008 (UTC) 3020:23:59, 21 December 2008 (UTC) 2985:19:16, 19 December 2008 (UTC) 2953:07:23, 19 December 2008 (UTC) 2934:16:05, 18 December 2008 (UTC) 2874:13:45, 18 December 2008 (UTC) 2853:00:17, 18 December 2008 (UTC) 2822:22:26, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2809:22:24, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2795:, where it may be deleted if 2689:13:56, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2674:13:54, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2664:12:40, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2646:11:45, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2637:11:35, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2619:11:25, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2579:11:24, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 2483:07:43, 16 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January 2009 (UTC) 3174:17:08, 4 January 2009 (UTC) 3079:19:27, 6 January 2009 (UTC) 2762:Knowledge's deletion policy 2296:informed of this discussion 1681:List of people from Lahijan 484:WP:V#Self-published sources 188:Deleting our page (Senario) 10: 4259: 2812:Sorry about the template. 2529:Many thanks for you help 2270:was a minister during the 2266:for five difficult years. 2262:was the prime minister of 114:Deleted as wrong namespace 3643:Broke-ass Stuart, et. al. 3220:. Thanks for your time. - 2899:Private Equity Task Force 2785:proposed deletion process 2550:11:46, 4 March 2009 (UTC) 1282:Talk:Languages of Belgium 4228:You may wish to respond 2789:speedy deletion criteria 2562:User_talk:193.172.170.26 797:Mark Turner's birth date 161:Knowledge:Project Leader 120:Knowledge:Project Leader 2260:Pierre-Célestin Rwigema 2221:Pierre-Célestin Rwigema 2219:Let's see. The article 638:Did you know? talk page 413:Self-published material 157:Wikiedia:Project Leader 138:Wikiedia:Project Leader 4144:Dutch conversation at 4049:list be alphabetized? 3102: 2799:to delete is reached. 2754:criteria for inclusion 2719: 2458:WT:CSD#Blitz deletions 2145: 497:Finally, please check 4146:User talk:Daveneijsen 4089:Mark Libbery/Libbeter 3877:Tarantula (DC Comics) 3101: 3057:Mylon LeFevre Article 2793:Articles for Deletion 2791:or it can be sent to 2758:What Knowledge is not 2718: 2139: 1310:Bayan Knights article 946:from the re-creator. 42:of past discussions. 3183:I have restored it. 3081:(cleanup volunteer) 2089:undeleting this page 2085:WT:P*#Shaun Costello 1586:Deacon of Pndapetzim 1551:Deacon of Pndapetzim 3462:I posted a request 3158:Image:Panoramix.png 3137:User:Flaming/MC2008 3112:) is wishing you a 2294:(Disclosure: I was 721:That was my point. 600:DYK for Mark Canton 4220:Nederlandse babbel 4122:User:MacGyverMagic 3103: 2720: 2464:in more detail. — 2146: 2016:Mucking excavation 1608:Selective deletion 391:Le Petit Vingtième 257:Flemish, not Dutch 216:Please read ] and 106:Danger City Rebels 4016:into a redirect. 2963:Guido den Broeder 2728:proposed deletion 2553: 2536:comment added by 1593: 1558: 1267: 1253:comment added by 1214: 1203: 1202: 1153: 1142: 1141: 644: 643: 477: 461: 447:comment added by 103: 102: 54: 53: 48:current talk page 4250: 4246: 4245: 4224: 4223: 4215: 4214: 4208: 4203: 4194: 4193: 4185: 4184: 4176: 4175: 4169: 4163: 4151: 4150: 4139: 4138: 4111: 4110: 4093: 4092: 4084: 4083: 4063: 4062: 4041: 4040: 4030: 4029: 4008: 4007: 3999: 3998: 3973: 3972: 3964: 3963: 3945: 3937: 3936: 3928: 3927: 3908: 3907: 3871: 3870: 3862: 3861: 3834: 3833: 3810: 3809: 3801: 3800: 3781: 3780: 3771: 3770: 3761: 3760: 3748: 3747: 3739: 3738: 3730:Broke-ass stuart 3726:Broke-ass Stuart 3719: 3718: 3691: 3690: 3670: 3669: 3653:Broke-ass Stuart 3647: 3646: 3638: 3637: 3568: 3567: 3550: 3549: 3539: 3538: 3515: 3514: 3496: 3495: 3487: 3486: 3475: 3439: 3438: 3425: 3419: 3412: 3411: 3403: 3402: 3365: 3360: 3357: 3352: 3349: 3321: 3316: 3313: 3308: 3305: 3276: 3275: 3269: 3264: 3261: 3256: 3253: 3243: 3242: 3234: 3233: 3207: 3206: 3198: 3197: 3178: 3177: 3152: 3151: 3143: 3142: 3093: 3092: 3084: 3083: 3061: 3060: 3052: 3051: 3045: 3044: 3024: 3023: 3015: 3007: 2998: 2997: 2989: 2988: 2967: 2966: 2958: 2957: 2938: 2937: 2932: 2928: 2922: 2919: 2913: 2903:Harvest Partners 2890: 2889: 2886:Harvest Partners 2881: 2880: 2857: 2856: 2835: 2834: 2826: 2825: 2775: 2774: 2768: 2748: 2747: 2737: 2736: 2722: 2721: 2711: 2710: 2702: 2701: 2623: 2622: 2617: 2613: 2606: 2601: 2592: 2591: 2583: 2582: 2571:Given this diff 2567: 2566: 2556: 2555: 2552: 2530: 2507: 2506: 2502: 2501: 2462:#Pesonal attacks 2400: 2360: 2334:Rwandan Genocide 2326: 2325: 2312: 2290: 2289: 2272:Rwandan Genocide 2214: 2213: 2202:Thomas.macmillan 2192: 2191: 2183: 2182: 2162: 2161: 2148: 2147: 2132: 2131: 2120: 2119: 2100: 2099: 2079: 2078: 2070: 2069: 2001: 2000: 1982: 1981: 1971: 1970: 1965: 1961: 1954: 1949: 1940: 1939: 1931: 1930: 1924: 1920: 1913: 1908: 1898: 1897: 1892: 1888: 1881: 1876: 1869:Touch the Clouds 1858: 1857: 1838: 1837: 1832: 1828: 1821: 1816: 1803: 1802: 1794: 1793: 1766: 1765: 1736: 1735: 1724: 1723: 1719: 1718: 1704:sourced anyway. 1698: 1697: 1675: 1674: 1666: 1665: 1631: 1630: 1612: 1611: 1603: 1602: 1589: 1565: 1564: 1554: 1544: 1543: 1535: 1534: 1507: 1506: 1482: 1481: 1473: 1472: 1455: 1454: 1446: 1445: 1420: 1419: 1411: 1410: 1391: 1390: 1369: 1368: 1345: 1344: 1314: 1313: 1305: 1304: 1286: 1285: 1277: 1276: 1266: 1255:Emperor.of.Wikia 1247: 1222: 1221: 1216: 1215: 1213: 1209: 1199: 1196: 1190: 1187: 1184: 1158: 1154: 1152: 1148: 1138: 1135: 1129: 1126: 1068: 1060: 1052: 1018: 1010: 1002: 980: 952: 611: 604: 603: 464: 460: 441: 140:. :) oops. -- 81: 56: 55: 33: 32: 26: 4258: 4257: 4253: 4252: 4251: 4249: 4248: 4247: 4222: 4192: 4167: 4161: 4149: 4091: 4039: 4018:199.125.109.126 4006: 3987:Sephiroth storm 3971: 3935: 3869: 3808: 3645: 3548: 3494: 3476: 3423: 3417: 3410: 3363: 3358: 3355: 3350: 3347: 3319: 3314: 3311: 3306: 3303: 3267: 3262: 3259: 3254: 3251: 3241: 3205: 3150: 3141: 3125:Merry Christmas 3091: 3089:Merry Christmas 3059: 3013: 3005: 2996: 2965: 2888: 2833: 2831:Protect Belgium 2772: 2766: 2765: 2709: 2616: 2590: 2565: 2531: 2268:André Ntagerura 2233:André Ntagerura 2190: 2130: 2077: 2039:Rjm at sleepers 1989:Rjm at sleepers 1980: 1964: 1938: 1923: 1891: 1865:William Gentles 1831: 1801: 1773:reliable source 1734: 1731:Michel Coiffard 1673: 1610: 1584:Done. Regards, 1542: 1480: 1453: 1418: 1312: 1284: 1248: 1204: 1186: 1143: 1125: 1123:(like a game). 1120: 1084: 1066: 1063: 1062: 1058: 1050: 1016: 1013: 1012: 1008: 1000: 995: 976: 948: 940: 909:Gordonofcartoon 904: 902:Wolfberry again 853: 799: 764: 745: 662: 602: 570:Gordonofcartoon 539: 519: 442: 415: 386:fair use images 384:We may not use 359: 259: 240: 190: 116: 108: 77: 30: 22: 21: 20: 12: 11: 5: 4256: 4221: 4218: 4191: 4190:sock of banned 4188: 4183: 4182: 4148: 4142: 4137: 4136: 4099:194.81.151.145 4090: 4087: 4082: 4081: 4038: 4033: 4005: 4002: 3970: 3967: 3934: 3931: 3926: 3925: 3887:Washington, DC 3868: 3865: 3860: 3859: 3841: 3807: 3804: 3799: 3798: 3779: 3778: 3769: 3768: 3759: 3758: 3746: 3745: 3737: 3736: 3717: 3716: 3715: 3714: 3689: 3688: 3644: 3641: 3636: 3635: 3634: 3633: 3632: 3631: 3547: 3542: 3537: 3536: 3493: 3490: 3485: 3484: 3483: 3482: 3472: 3409: 3406: 3401: 3400: 3399: 3398: 3397: 3396: 3395: 3394: 3393: 3392: 3240: 3237: 3204: 3201: 3196: 3195: 3149: 3146: 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